Rosie Skene:

Hello,
and welcome to episode 40 of Triumph Beyond Trauma. I hope that you have had an
amazing start to 2025. Before we crack into this episode, I want to mention
that the First Responder Mental Wellness Method is available to join at any
time. If taking more control of your mental health journey is high on your
priority list, for 2025, my program is the perfect way to get started.

Priced at a very reasonable 247 Australian dollars, it is super
accessible to anyone. I personally love how easy the program is to navigate.
Having been there myself, deep in the depths of PTSD, anxiety, and depression,
I know how difficult it can be to do, get to a yoga class, to read another book
or even implement things that my therapist has given me.

This program gives you easy to follow lessons, three
implementation weeks, more if you choose, access anywhere at any time, and just
a really nice way to start understanding what's going on, why, and what you can
do now to take back control. If being in more control of your mental health
journey is something that interests you, head over to tacticalyogaaustralia.

com and check out the program there. No more wait lists, you
can just dive straight in and get immediate access.

Now, on to today's amazing guest, Stephanie Bochorski. Steph is
a West Australian police officer, an Australian Defence Force veteran, and an
absolutely exceptional woman.

Steph has the most incredible story to share with us today, and
for that has been awarded the inaugural National Police Bravery Medal, the Star
of Courage, and the Commissioner's Award for Bravery.

Steph is a passionate mental health advocate and is currently
studying psychology. I'm absolutely thrilled to bring this conversation to you.
It is always so lovely to meet with and speak to someone who is as passionate
about reducing the stigma around mental health issues within the first
responder and veteran communities as I am.

Definitely a heads up for this episode. Steph didn't receive
her medals for a run of the mill assault. The incident that she shares with us
is intense to say the least. It involves children and is domestic violence
related. We also talk about death by suicide. Please manage your own capacity
to listen to this episode today.

If you need mental health support, please reach out to any of
the services in the show notes. They are listed there for each and every
episode. With that, let's get into the final episode for season four.

Welcome to Triumph
Beyond Trauma, the podcast that explores journeys of resilience and hope. I'm
Rosie Skene a yoga and breathwork teacher and founder of Tactical Yoga
Australia. As a former soldier's wife, mum to three beautiful kids and a
medically retired NSW police officer with PTSD, I understand the challenges of
navigating mental health in the first responder and veteran community.

Join us for incredible stories from individuals who've
confronted the depths of mental illness and discovered their path to happiness
and purpose, as well as solo episodes and expert discussions. Together, we'll
uncover the tools to help you navigate your journey toward a brighter, more
fulfilling life.

Whether you're looking for helpful insights, practical tips, or
just a friendly reminder that you're not alone. Triumph Beyond Trauma has got
your back. You matter and your journey to a happier, more meaningful life
starts right here.

Steph, welcome to Triumph Beyond Trauma. It's so good to have
you here. Finally. We've been trying to tee it up for a little while.

Steph Bochorsky:

Yes.
Thank you for having me.

Rosie Skene:

Usually
I start with a bit about your background and how you've come to join for you,
West Australian Police and Defence. , so I'd love for you to give us a bit of
your background and history and how both of those things came about.

Steph Bochorsky:
Yeah, so, , I grew up in Perth, Western Australia, and I attended, uh, Craigie
Primary School and went to high school at, uh, Woodvale, Woodvale, it's called,
um, where I was accepted into the music program, . Growing up, I did feel like
I was a bit of a black sheep amongst my siblings, I'm the youngest of a, um,
brother and sister, and, , I guess what changed as I was growing up was in high
school, and, um, I experienced a lot of challenges.

, ranging from bullying, and then I found a diagnosis, , my mum
was diagnosed with, , breast cancer. So, , with experiencing those challenges,
as well as the diagnosis of my mum, , It kind of led me onto the path of, I
don't know, I just felt like when I was 17, when I turned 17, I had a, um, I
knew that I either wanted to join the police or the military, , because my dad
was a firefighter and my mom was a patient care attendant.

We're seeing them both, both my parents in these roles in
serving the community. , I saw that and I admired that for stepping up to
protect and serve the community, obviously in different ways, because, you
know, dad being a firefighter and a patient care attendant, when I say, ,
serving and protecting the communities, obviously in different ways.

However, back then I felt that it was, um, I had a deep sense
of responsibility to do the same sort of thing.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

, so
from a young age, I knew I wanted to serve the community. I just didn't know
how. And it was from my experiences in high school that led me to think. Maybe
that was a sign saying, hey, , here's your future help people who can't fight
back.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,

Steph Bochorsky:

I
guess. Um, so I, as a kid running around, I've never thought that I'd ever be
cut out for a nine to five job. Sitting behind a desk and and doing
spreadsheets. Uh, no, thanks. No, that's not me. Sounds horrible, right?
Fucking awful even but now I can't imagine it. Um, Um, I needed a career. I I
felt as though I was best suited my personality and my deep desire with serving
and upholding justice I wanted to serve and protect and be the one to call when
when chaos hits the fan And, , I felt policing was the best suit for me
because, um, policing to me isn't just about flashing authority and it's not
just about showing, , up where it's about showing up when people are at their
lowest and offering safety and support and maybe restoring a little bit of
faith and humanity and that's kind of, as my career has progressed, that's how
I felt at the time that that's where I wanted to make an impact.

Yeah. Yeah. So how old were you when you joined? I joined the
police when I was 21. So that was back in, uh, December 1st, 2008. Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

. So, ,
how did you find that process of joining and all the examinations?

Were you excited for it? Was it challenging for you? Um,

Steph Bochorsky:

it
was definitely challenging, I think, because the fact that the day that I sat
the police exam was the day that I lost my mum to the fight to cancer.

Rosie Skene:

Wow.

Steph Bochorsky:

So,
a lot of people at that time, , and my dad was like, you don't have to sit the
exam, especially, you know, dealing with that.

My mum was my number one supporter. She was my cheerleader. She
was my frontrunner. Um, and she knew this is something that I always wanted to
do when I was, like I said, when I was young. It was either policing or army. I
knew that. I just didn't know which one.

Um, so I knew that I was able to put my own feelings and
emotions aside.

on that morning sitting the exam in order to get through it.
So, um, yes, there were challenges, but back then I felt that I had pretty
thick skin and I was able to overcome lots of challenges and obstacles at that
time.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.
Yeah. That's incredible that you were able to do that and sit that exam. Yeah,
it's intense.

so where did you go
after you've done all your training? What sort of policing do you go straight
into? Like a general duties? policing in Western Australia?

Steph Bochorsky:
Yeah. So, um, I've been in for 16 years now. So a big chunk of my career has
been, , a frontline patrols inquiries officer. Yeah. Uh, I did a little bit of
undercover work, which was with liquor licensing before going down the path of,
, a family domestic violence officer and a specialist child assessment
interviewer.

Um, So that, that's where majority of my career was and around
about the time when I was doing country service, that's when another police
officer told me about the army reserves. And that's what got me into going,
well, I never got to pursue it as a full time career because I got accepted
into the police.

Um, what better way to be able to do it part time to see that
something that I'd love and it was something I loved. So I ended up joining the
army reserves in, , 2010. Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.
Wow. And are you still serving now?

Steph Bochorsky:

I
wish, , I was only in for, , 34 years. And then due to, , being in the country
and compacting issues to discharge, but I'm in the process of actually wanting
to get back in, so I'm hoping that they will accept me back in because I miss
it immensely and I've still got lots of mates that are in the Army Reserves and
I hear about it all the time, so I'm really hopeful.

That I can get back in. Yeah, definitely. Yeah,

Rosie Skene:

that's
so cool. So, , Steph. The 28th of August 2015 was a pivotal day in your life,
undoubtedly. Can you share, , what happened on that day and what led you to act
and how you reflect on what happened that day now?

Steph Bochorsky:

Yeah, , so August 2015, , I was off duty at my home, um, In double view, that's
where I was living at the time, and I only moved into that house two weeks
prior to this happening. So it was, yeah, bizarre. That was almost like I was
meant to be there. , I was sitting in, uh, settling in for the night after
coming off from night shift, and I was sitting on the couch, , in my pajamas,
and I had a movie on pause in the back of the house, which is, um, yeah, so, so
my bedroom is situated in the back of the house.

And I was interested in a, , UFC comeback special on TV, which
was in the living room, which is situated at the front of the house. And, , I
was alerted to what sounded like a, a argument across the road. , and I heard a
woman screaming and I opened up my fly screen. My wooden door, but I had the
fly screen door still situated and she was pacing to and from the door saying,
it's okay.

No, one's no one's here. No one's here to come get you or
something along the lines of that. And all I could hear was a male voice
yelling back. The Maris are out to get me. Um, and she's just consult
consolidating him. And at that point, after listening in from what I could hear
from across the street. I thought that's just a couple having an argument.

I'm just going to leave my screen door open and if anything
happens and I can make a call or whatnot and I sat back down and wouldn't have
even been a minute that passed and I heard out of blood curdling scream from
this woman. So I ran out onto the my front porch and asked, I yelled out to her
across the road.

Are you okay? Do you need help? And she was quite distressed
and she yelled back at me, hysterical, um, no, you're setting my kids on fire.
So, I immediately, , ran across the road to her and I ran past her and I told
her no one is to come in after me and to call the police. When I entered the
house, I could smell a strong odor of petrol in the air and my eyes were
diverted to the right hand side of the house and it was almost like the room
was like a flickering light, you know, if you were to leave a candle, um, so my
attention was drawn to that room.

So I ran into that room and that's when I saw, um, the three
year old standing up in a cot with a whole head, um, engulfed in fire. And the
only words. That could leave my mouth at that time was, oh, my God. Yeah, I
just couldn't believe what I was confronted with and what I was saying. Um, I
saw a blanket on a bed and I immediately threw it over her to put the flames
out.

And as soon as I did that, I did feel this presence from behind
me. So as I'm dealing with her, I turned, I turned over to look over my
shoulder and I saw him who was the father of, The three year old standing over
his eight year old little girl, dousing her with petrol, so her face was, ,
yeah, face was totally being, , drenched in petrol as well.

Um, he was, you know, six foot tall, he was big solid guy, ,
and I'm, as I'm watching this, , a three year old little girl who had her
hands. Really tightly around my neck. So not only could I smell. Her burnt
flesh, but I could, I could feel like the petrol going onto my clothes as well.
Yeah. And in my moment, I thought to myself, fuck, like, how am I going to get
these kids out?

What's he going to do? Um, cause at the time I, I had tunnel
vision as well. And I didn't know that he had a big butcher knife and in the
other hand, so he could have punched at any of us at any of that time. Um, and
in that moment, I thought the only thing I could do was use my voice And
maintain my distance to give him, um, clear verbal instructions and I told him
to get the fuck back and he just looked blankly back at me.

Um, thankfully that's all he did because I didn't have any
recruitments or protection. Um, I don't know if the police were called after I
told the mum to call when I ran past her. So I thought he's gonna set the eight
year old little girl on fire any moment now because she was drenched in the
petrol.

That I crept forward and I was saying to her, come on, sweetie,
get up and she wasn't listening and she wasn't responding. So that's when I
grabbed the back of her pajamas of her collar and I dragged her out of her bed
with my eyes locked on him the whole time.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,

Steph Bochorsky:

and
he didn't, he actually didn't move, which I was surprised with.

Um, so I had the two girls and I was walking backwards whilst I
kept my eyes on him with them and I exited the house. Safe with the girls.
Thank God. So, once outside, um, I directed the child's mum to remain outside,
um, until the police arrived and I told her that, um, I was really concerned
with the little girl's burns, um, I'm taking her across the road to my house.

To attend to them. So, um, I'm holding her and the whole time
I'm walking across the road and talking to her. The thing that sticks out for
me the most is she wasn't screaming. She wasn't crying. She was just sobbing
the whole time. And for a 3 year old, having a 3 year old myself, who's very
vocal, um, I think that's the thing that stood out for me the most.

And I still get choked up about it, thinking about it, because.
When I put her when I went into the bathroom and put her on the bench, she was
just sobbing. She, um, when I unbuttoned one of her, like, the top of her
button, I could see the severity of the burns. It was almost like my tattoos,
you know, it was black.

At that point, I thought, Um, I need to get her into the
shower. So, um, which over the shower is over my bathtub, so I had to turn the
shower on to fill the bathtub. And I picked her up to put her in the bathtub
and, , she wouldn't let go of me. She was holding on that tight again. And, um,
so as, as I'm holding her, I thought, okay, well, I'm going to have to jump in
the, in the shower with her fully clothed.

So I started taking my socks off. And that's when she saw that
the bathtub was filling and she let go. So I was able to put her down
comfortably into the bath. And as I'm talking to her, I was wondering why she
wasn't looking up at me. And to my realisation, um, her neck had looked like it
had melted into her chest.

So she couldn't move her head and her ear looked like it was
singed off and her beautiful hair was breaking off and into the bath. And, , at
that point, I heard a female officer come in, call out to me from my front door
and I told her that I was in the bathroom and she walked in. She took one
little, she took one look at the little girl and the color from her face just
drained.

It went like pale white. I asked her if she was okay. I said,
look, the ambulance need to come here. And she didn't even hesitate. I just
think that she wanted to leave the bathroom as quickly as she could because of
the severity of the injuries that she had, which in my mind is still kind of
blacked out, numbed out at this point.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

Um,
I think my mind is just, Um, and because she was shocked over the injuries to
exit the house and get the St. John ambulance, I think it put me in a better
position to be able to attend to her. Um, but once the police arrived a short
time later, the father was arrested and charged with two counts of attempted
murder along with like a numerous length of other serious offenses.

Um, I couldn't sleep that night for obvious reasons. And the
next morning I ended up going to the children's hospital and I was advised by
nursing staff that the three year old was in an induced coma to the severity of
her burns. And the nurse also advised me that the mum and the other two
children, um, and when I say two children, it was a little boy,

who was in a separate room.

So thankfully he got out, um, and he was able to run out of the
house in time. But it wasn't until I went to the hospital that day, um, and why
the eight year old little girl wasn't talking back at me. It was because she
had severe autism and she was non verbal. Um, so, yeah, that, hearing that just
signified that, um, yeah, you just can't comprehend, like, a father that's
meant to be your ultimate protector can do that to their kids, let alone
anyone.

Mm. But it's I still can't get over her move past, I don't
think, it's just, yeah, he deserves what he gets.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,
yeah, well, I totally agree with you. Um, especially such vulnerable children,
like, yeah, I don't, I think if you could understand it, Then, you know, you'd
want to look into that, then not being able to understand it, right?

Like, I don't think you're supposed to be able to understand
any sort of thinking behind that at all.

Steph Bochorsky:

No,
you can't comprehend it, can you? No. I feel to this day you can't comprehend
it.

Rosie Skene:

No.

Steph Bochorsky:

Hmm.

Rosie Skene:

Um,
yeah, it's so hard, mate. Um, do you keep in contact with that, the kids at
all? Have you caught up with them since you saw them?

Steph Bochorsky:
Yeah, I wanted to, um, but because, um, as you noticed, I haven't been saying
names. Yeah, no, no, yeah. Yeah. And that's because it's still, very much a,
um, because there's still kids secrecy. Oh, okay. Yeah, the

Rosie Skene:

privacy.

Steph Bochorsky:

Yeah, so the privacy around their names and, um, also mum doesn't, didn't want
to be, um, associated with him anymore for obvious reasons.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

And
didn't show up at the court proceedings as well, um, for privacy because she
wanted her privacy and just wanted to move past this. All of them have PTSD
because of it. All have, um, restraining orders. Orders for life because of it.
Um, and I did want to reach out and I ended up contacting the lead detective in
charge of the case and they had since been relocated and I actually did get her
number, the mother's number, that the next day when I was in hospital.

So I asked her if you ever need anything you want to reach out
to please contact me. But then that phone ended up getting damaged and I was
never able to recover the phone number from her. So yeah, I, I did want to
reach back out, but unfortunately, um, because of change of where they live
and, um, I don't have to change their names, but yeah, back in contact.

But this is, this is, this plays on my mind every day. I
always. I wish that I could reconnect with the mom and kids because I really do
want to see how she's gone. I have on my mantelpiece in my lounge room from the
police legacy. I've got like a little police teddy bear. And that's up there.
So that's a reminder every day.

So I was meant to give that to her and I never got an
opportunity to give that to her. So every day I have a reminder of it. Yeah,

Rosie Skene:

yeah, I
would be the same. I would definitely want to reconnect. So did you hear about
how she, how she recovered at all?

Steph Bochorsky:

So,
um. The, yeah, as I, as I said, the, all of them had PTSD as a result of what's
happened, but she has to have, yeah, so I'm going to get choked up about this,
um, she has to have surgery for the rest of her life because of the severity of
the burns.

Her skin doesn't stretch, so she can't spend long, long, long
amounts of time outdoors or in the sun. Um, and she has to have ongoing surgery
into, you know, her life. As she grows. Yeah, because of the, because of her
skin and, um, the impact that that had on her. Yeah. So to look in the mirror
every day and be reminded of who did that to her, I can't imagine what she is
going through.

But from what I've heard from reconnecting with the lead,
actually the lead detective, when I did my specialist child interviewing
course, He was actually on the course, so I was able to, to ask him about it,

Speaker 4:

and

Steph Bochorsky:

that
they were all thriving, doing so much better now, so it was just so really good
to hear that, because that mother copped so much flank on social media, it
pissed me off, because most people's comments were around, you know, Why didn't
she run into the room?

Why didn't she do this? Why didn't she do that? She did what
she had to do in those moments and she did what was right. And that was calling
out and screaming out for help because she didn't know what to do. And he, like
I said, he was a massive dude. And he was violent and he was a, um, he was a
domestic violence perpetrator.

That she did exactly what she needed to do and she deserves
acknowledgement for that. She deserves to be, um, like I said, applauded for
that and not punished as a mother because those kids are still here because she
asked for help.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,

Steph Bochorsky:
that's right. Yeah, it wasn't just me that went in the house that day.

I had a neighbour that went in and fought him off and he got a,
um, an award in recognition of that. Rightfully so. He did amazing.

Yeah, the fact that lots, lots of us neighbours that came
together to support her on that night because of her screaming out for help,
she deserves recognition for that not to be, um, labelled and put down as a
mother, it's, it was completely unfair and it really, yeah, that really annoyed
me at the time when that happened.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.
Oh, mate. The strongest thing that she did was to get out of there and ask
other people to help. Like, right. Yeah. Who knows what would have happened to
her if she would have stayed?

Steph Bochorsky:

It could have been her in court, crossfire of it. We just don't know. And that's
what people need to realise is she could have been a statistic along with those
kids if she didn't call out that night.

And I wouldn't, I wouldn't have known someone would have heard
it.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,

Steph Bochorsky:
that's it. And no other neighbour would have heard it, or it was too late. So
she did exactly what she needed to do in those moments, and that's what saved
those kids lives.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:
Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

Um, I
haven't written this question down, but I've been thinking about it a little
bit.

But, you know, when you're at work, as a cop. You probably
unknowingly even some people would go into like a little process like I'm at
work. Okay, I'm gonna do this job But I think sometimes you would unknowingly
go. Okay, I'm gonna go to work I'm a cop my jobs to protect the community and
then when you leave you're like, okay I'm going to my home, which is usually a
safe space um How have you dealt with that?

Sort of having the job find you in your home.

Steph Bochorsky:

Do
you mean like it following you back home? Yeah,

Rosie Skene:

but just
you're not prepared at all to have to deal with an incident like that where you
would be at work, probably not even to that extent to be honest with you. Like
that's a really bad day at work as a cop.

to go to something like that, but for you to just be at your
home watching TV, getting ready for the afternoon, I guess, but, and then
having to deal with that, how has that affected you?

Steph Bochorsky:

Oh,
massively, because it was, it was the dominoes effect that the dominoes effect
that followed on from that night in regards to how I was treated and the
support, lack of support that I got at the time.

Which made me sit in my head too much.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

And
as you would know, Rosie, as, as police officers, I tell you to switch off, but
you know, you have these incidences like this one, or, you know, I had my
third, one of my first, uh, 3, 3, 8, sorry, um, you know, sudden death call
jobs, and that was a little girl, and that didn't prepare me for, you know, I
wasn't prepared with just how she would respond to seeing her dad hanging from
a beam in their living room and her turning around and shooting me a big smile
saying, Daddy's fixing the roof and it's those moments you take home with you
and you think to yourself, could I have done more?

Should I have done more? Why didn't I do more? Um, how, how do
I get to sleep? You know, like, am I, am I meant to be thinking these feelings?
Am I, am I meant to be thinking these thoughts? And I think that's the biggest
problem amongst first responders is we don't have these debriefs anymore. I
remember when we first, when I first started policing, you were able to sit
down and have a debrief and have your dark, we all have the dark sense of
humour.

And that's what I love. That's what I love about policing.
That's especially what I love about the army is you have the dark sense of
humour to share amongst your colleagues in order to process. Your thoughts and
feelings, because if you're feeling a certain way, you better bet your dollar
that someone else is feeling exactly what you're feeling.

And when you talk these things out, you're able to process and
you're able to store it somewhere in your memory bank. And I cops aren't going
to . We're not, we're not going to go seek. The help because we're just going
to be like, no, it's okay. It's my job. Um, I put on this uniform. I'm meant to
be, um, I guess, heroic in a sense, you know, I'm bulletproof.

Whereas at the end of the day, you take the uniform off. We're
all human. Why that persona is still very much thrown out there. I wish I could
answer that, um, because ever since, I hate saying the dreaded C word, but ever
since COVID happened, I think mental health is definitely at the forefront for
a lot, a lot of people, especially first responders, not just police, but we're
talking paramedics, fire brigade, St.

nursing's, nurses, um, teachers. Thank you We're all taking on
a whole lot more than what was expected of us before, prior, yeah, prior COVID.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah, I
agree with that too. My husband was in Defence during COVID and the
expectations on them, um, during COVID was incredible. Like, some of the things
I'm sure Defence aren't supposed to do, but they do it because that's what
they're told to do, right?

Yeah. And everyone else is the same. Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

Yeah, that's right.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,
you just briefly mentioned about the lack of support that you've received from
work. Um, and of course, like that incident and along with the other incident
you mentioned with the little girl and her dad at the hanging, um, they impact
your life. There's no ifs, buts or maybes about it. It doesn't matter who you
are.

Um, Do you want to talk about that impact that it has had on
your life and then at what point did you decide that it was time to seek some
help?

Steph Bochorsky:

Yeah, absolutely. So, um, with that incident, um, I think because there was
obviously, which we briefly touched on with challenges that were in my early
childhood, you know, with losing my mum to cancer, to being bullied.

Other jobs that I attended in my early career that were quite
confrontational and traumatic. I was in denial for three years after that
incident because when you join the police, you don't want to be portrayed as
weak. And especially as a female officer, you don't want to be portrayed as an
emotional wreck either.

And unfortunately,

based on my personal experience and how I was treated. And how
I've spoken to, since then, spoken to other female officers and how they've
been treated, as opposed to the male colleagues, um, that have, you know, come
forward and talk about their struggles. So, when I was in denial for 3 years,
that's when the symptoms and that, because I was in denial, because I don't
want to be portrayed as weak, because I was putting on the tough front
exterior, things kept on popping up to the surface.

Um, irritability, my lack of sleep, flashbacks, um, lack of
concentration, , my lack of drive for the job anymore. And over the last six
years, I've sought my own help and intervention. Through, um, you know, stellar
injections, , which didn't help, , I've, , I've been hospitalized, you know,
doing a trauma recovery program to seek help, , doing talk therapy, , just to
stay afloat.

And so many people assume that you should be healed now because
this has gone back 2015. However, , I was. I felt ashamed to ask for the help
and letting other others bear witness to my mess that I couldn't make sense of
in my head. The last thing that I wanted to do is admit that maybe I do have
PTSD.

Um, because, um, I also just want to mention as well that I
want people to know that with healing and when you're, We're on this road to
recovery that there is no link there. It's not linear. It's there is no, you're
fully recovered. Setbacks are going to be inevitable. It's meaning to stay on
top of that.

And the largest misconception I've come against with PTSD is
that people think that I am forgetful. People think that I'm lazy towards
relationships and I wish people just knew just how often I would stare at my
phone, wishing that I knew how to call them or how to answer the texts. Um,
because when you're in crisis mode, you tend to get tunnel vision and I think
the absolute worst case scenario is that all you can focus on is surviving and,
um, I'm constantly, I was constantly assessing threats, figuring out how to
neutralise staying calm, remaining calm, um, when there was emotional chaos.

That you deal with as a police officer, as well as going home.
I wish I knew that, um, yeah, I wish I knew at the time just to, to do, um, to
accept the help earlier. Um, yeah, sorry, I'm, I've gone on a bit of a tangent
then.

Rosie Skene:

No,
you're alright. Um, it wasn't

Steph Bochorsky:

until, uh, it was, there was an incident that happened when I was working.

And it wasn't until I got home that I realized and I woke my
husband up and I said, I don't think I'm coping, I need help. And my husband is
a beautiful man and sometimes he can't be too honest with me. Um, and he knew I
was struggling. I just don't think he knew how to address it with me, but that
night when I said that, and I was having dark thoughts about no longer wanting
to be here and expressing that to him after an incident after like another
incident at work.

That's what started the process of. Seeking help and
intervention. Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,
wow. Is it because, just with your husband, is he um, do you shut him down
sometimes, do you reckon? Because I know I do with mine. If he brings something
up and I can't see it myself sometimes, I'll be like, no mate, that's not
what's going on.

But usually he's pretty spot on the money. He's like

Steph Bochorsky:

You
don't understand. Yeah, you do. Yeah, I do. I do tend to shut him down quite a
bit when it comes to that. But it's like a sense of you don't understand what
I'm going through. Fuck off. Which is what I do say. It's more so. I don't
understand what's going on in my head. How do I explain to you what's going on
in my head?

Yes, it's coming out in other areas of me throwing dishes.
Well, I don't do that, but I'm trying to provide some examples, you know,
throwing the dishes about or yelling, you know, yelling is a perfect one, like
yelling back at him over something. But why are you snapping up over me, over,
I don't know, me not throwing dishes?

The, um, the rubbish out into the garbage bin, it's like, it's
not just that isolated thing I'm annoyed about, you've got to understand it's
a, it's a build up of things.

Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. I definitely do do that. Yeah. Tough. But
I like to think that, oh, it is tough. It is tough for them because they want
to help and they don't know how to go into fix it mode.

And that's all men want to do. They want to go into fix it
mode. And that's what he wants to do sometimes. And I've said to him, um, and
I'm big on communication, um, since I've sought help with this because of me
being shut down for so long. I said to him, when I'm having these talks with
you, all you need to do is ask me the question, do you want me to fix it or do
you want me to listen?

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

That's all I ask him to ask. Say, I just want you to listen. Just let me vent.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

And
then, um, and that usually works. And, uh, so he'll let me have my vent and
then I'll say, I'll be like, thank you for not going to fix it. mode don't need
you to, I just want you to listen because I'm obviously needing to get
something off my chest and you are my best friend.

And it helps to just have someone there to just vent with. So
he's my biggest support, he's my biggest support, he's my biggest rock through
all this. I've lost so many friends. Um, I've only got one best friend who's
in, um, still serving in the Army. Everyone else has kind of just like fallen
back, I guess, because as I've chosen this path of recovery.

Um, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of people perceive you as what
you were, to how you should be, but you're not that person anymore. It's a very
hard transition, to move past, especially. It is very difficult,

Rosie Skene:

um,
because there's, there's so many facets to losing the friendships, I think,
too. Like, I know, for me, when I was in the COPS, and I know that people
would, were leaving because of mental health issues, you know, there was a very
strong stance about, you You know, you can't just turn up at their front door.

You can't go there in uniform. You can't do this. You can't do
that. So you're almost. Well, no, you were, you're encouraged not to go and see
them or call them or like, you know, in fear of triggering them in inverted
commas. But what that did was they lost contact with everybody that they
thought, you know, sort of had their back at work.

No one contacted them except for the, you know, the duty
officer that was supposed to do it once a month. So then they lose contact. All
of that connection, and it's, and it happened to me too, like, I'm sure it
happens to most people. I think that's where we can get a bit better, right,
in, in those organizations, in looking after people.

Yeah, and you've

Steph Bochorsky:

highlighted such a significant point as well, because now that you've mentioned
that, Um, I actually was told not until years later that my OIC, so my officer
in charge of my station at that time, actually called up certain officers and
gave them a direct order not to contact me and not to call me, not to text me.

And this is why I thought that I lost so many friends, was
because I thought they just didn't fucking care. Whereas no, they were given a
direct order not to contact me when I needed a friend. I needed a cop mate,
because they understand. With, you know, your family members and that that
aren't police officers or defence or other first responders.

I don't understand. Um, so, yeah, it's disgraceful that that
happens and it breaks my heart that that still happens because we need to be
the job is tough enough as it is. We need to be surrounding each other and
being each other's backbones and supporting one another and uplifting one
another not, you know, being too scared.

That we're going to trigger someone. Sometimes sitting with
someone and watching a series and having a cup of coffee would be enough for
some people, honestly.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

Um.
Yeah. You're so right.

Rosie Skene:

It's just one of the biggest things I think, and it's something that I miss not
being in anymore, is that connection, the camaraderie, you know, the feeling
that you're part of a pretty elite team.

There's not a lot of people in the world that are police and
it's a different type of job. Defence as well. Any first responder job, there's
that culture that's there and it's something that you deeply miss. Um, so to
not have that anymore, it's, it definitely exacerbates. The trauma, because
you, you've just, you're grieving as well.

Yeah, it's brutal.

Steph Bochorsky:

Yeah. And I think that's another thing that's really bad as well with the
treatment is if someone does, like I experienced it firsthand is, and with
mates that I've spoken to who have since left is when they do finally come
forward and speak out, it's not that they can't still perform their tasks and
their duties.

They get isolated from doing their work, whereas the struggles
of whatever they're struggling with, the job, the policing, or whatever career
aspect we're talking about, that's the thing that they're fighting for and they
live for that day. And you know, you have these things that they're protecting
them by taking them away from their operational duties or trying to take them
away from their roles.

It's actually causing more harm than good. Let, let their
doctors be the decider of if they can still perform certain tasks or not. Not
them making that choice for them. And I don't like that.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.
Yeah. I couldn't agree more. So because of your actions that day in 2015,
you've been awarded the inaugural National Police Bravery Award, the
Commissioner's Award for bravery and the star of Courage. Congratulations. I
think that's bloody amazing and well deserved, obviously. How have you felt
about receiving these accolades?

And is there any challenges with you in relation to, um,
experiencing that trauma, but then being celebrated for your bravery as well?

Steph Bochorsky:

Yes,
that's a good question. Um, yeah, when I first received the The call in 2018
from, um, the Chief Executive of, , Scott Weber from the Police Federation of
Australia telling me about the award, , the Australian National Police Bravery
Award.

I actually did think it was a prank call, I actually did I
think I remember telling him to fuck off, I think, from memory. And he goes,
it's not a joke, Steph. This is not a scam call. Um, this is an actual, because
I was like, what is the Police Federation of Australia? I've never heard of it.
Never heard of it.

And I wasn't, I was not expecting it. Um, and, you know, out of
everyone in Australia that was nominated, I found out through when Scott told,
when I was having a conversation with Scott Weber, he said, one person
nominated you and I said, who and he said, it was your husband. Um, so how my
husband even came to think and have to look for that as well.

Um, he didn't have to do that. So I was so thankful. For not
only him supporting me and, and doing something completely out of the box, but
to get that call and then to unexpectedly be flown to Canberra, it was just,
um, really overwhelming. I think because a sense of I wasn't expecting it
because like I said, it was, this is 3 years after 15.

Yes, 3 years after. So it came out of nowhere. Um, I met some
really, truly amazing people, , over in Canberra, , and I was even awarded by,
, Peter Dutton. And, , when I look at my medals, I, I got to be honest, I don't
see what other people see. what other people see. For me, the work I did,
whether it be to serve the community, my country or individuals, it comes from
a place of duty, not my desire for recognition.

So, I do view them as a part of what is expected of me as a
person, but also as a professional. Um, and to be celebrated and awarded with
awards. What feels like to me is doing my job. It does create a bit of an
internal conflict within me. , it almost feels as though , the accolades shine
too bright on the spotlight of what I consider them to be a reminder of.

A career that I love that I can no longer pursue, um, which
eats me up and because I, I know that I have, I had a lot more in me to do way
more, way, way more than just that, that incident. And it's also, I remind,
those medals are also an impact on the mental health. That has changed me, and
that's hard, and how hard I have to work at that every day in order to keep
those symptoms at bay.

So, um, in saying this, receiving those accolades comes from,
not, doesn't come from ingratitude, but from, um, the strong belief that true
fulfillment comes from the work itself, not the applause that may follow from
it. So for me, the reward lies in the positive impact that I hopefully made on
others. But not the recognition.

So it's a bit of a push pull. So as much as I am thankful and
honoured by the medals I've received, it still holds a really heavy weight on me
about the things that I no longer have.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,
that's pretty much the reason I asked the question, actually, because I can
imagine there'd be this definite internal struggle with it because they're
pretty amazing awards to receive.

Um, and then, you know, to do it, , like you said, , you're
just doing a job and what you're supposed to be doing, but then that you also
can't. do that anymore. And I have that same feeling about, , with my, um, PTSD
is that it's taken away something that I've really loved so much, like going to
work and putting on my uniform and doing something that I felt helped the
community.

Um, so I can really resonate with that and that reminder for
you when you look at your, your medals about that.

Steph Bochorsky:
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. And, um, yeah, as I said, it's just that constant
reminder of what I don't have anymore. And It's almost like when you receive an
award like that, and the expert, it's almost like you put And a bigger
expectation on you that, wow, I've just received a medal for this.

I need to exceed, um, above that. It kind of feels like that as
well.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

And
because I wasn't, and because I was obviously affected by the aftermath of
everything of, of the Domino's effect that followed suit from that. I couldn't
help but feel like I'm a massive failure, um, and that's, that's something I've
had to overcome for.

I'm still overcoming. Yeah yeah. So I felt
like I said, I feel like I could have given, given back so much more and the
fact that that's been taken away from me and I don't have a choice now. Due to,
, my doctor, uh, putting me up for retirement. It's.

Yeah, it's

heart breaking. Yeah, because I want to do more.

I love the job.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.
Yeah. Um, so what's next for you? I know, I know that you're studying
psychology, which is really exciting. , What inspired that decision to do that?
And, and how do you think that your lived experience will, , help or influence
your approach to psychology?

Steph Bochorsky:

Yeah, so, um, I think from my policing background.

Where we are often exposed to trauma, violence, human suffering
on the daily basis, um, the long shifts, the understaffing and , operational
demands leave little time for recovery, while we have this toughen up culture.
It's just still very much in the forefront of which discourages office.

And with my background with repeat exposure to critical
incidences such as domestic violence suicides fatalities Um, accumulates into
unresolved psychological stress, often, um, manifests into burnout. And because
of this, um, after 16 years of policing, I've, I've seen the best, the worst,
and downright confusing sides of human behaviour.

And let's just say I've spent a fair share of time wondering
what on earth were they thinking. Hmm? And sometimes what on earth was I
thinking, um, from calming down domestic disputes or interviewing children with
the aftermath of trauma, it has became clear to me that I wanted to have a
deeper understanding of what goes inside, what goes on inside people's heads
as, and I feel as though that's important, just as important as keeping them
out of trouble.

However, as a family domestic violence officer that's now
transitioning into studying psychology, um, I feel that there's always a story
behind the chaos.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

Um,
usually trauma, broken systems, , unaddressed mental health struggles. , it's
like being in an endless , a true crime documentary where the answers just
aren't that obvious.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

So,
I chose to study psychology because of my strong desire for understanding the
human mind and why people do what they do. crisis or chaotic times, but not
just that. And not because I want to go into fixing everyone, because life's
just not that simple. And I'm definitely not that talented or that smart, far
from it.

But I want to dig deeper and I want to be, and I am fascinated
with the human behaviour and why people do what they do. And psychology provides
me with the tools to understand the messiness. Um, so with combining my
policing experience with my knowledge, I hope to not just ask, okay, what's
happened, what's brought you in here today, but also help with rewriting that
ending for them.

Or at least making it a little less dramatic and more a
fulfilling life for them and what they deserve because that's what we all
deserve. We all deserve peace. This is going to sound so PC, but so we do all
deserve peace on earth.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Steph Bochorsky:

And
although that as a police officer, I was attending to people that were at their
worst.

Parts of their life. I think I'd like to go. I want to go into
psychology because then I can go into it. Okay. How can I fix this? Well, not
as I said before, it's not fix this. It's more how can I help? To resolve or
help you process emotions that you should be feeling, as opposed to feeling as
a police officer, you feel, you know, weak or you feel that something's wrong
with me to be feeling these feelings and I want to help that process a little
bit better and I think coming from a policing perspective and seeing how the
system is, I would also like to get into the avenue of supporting feelings of
Um, police officers that are going through it and hopefully if they're
transitioning out or want to remain in.

Um, I think hearing it from someone that's lived it and
experienced it will help them be able to open up a bit more because so many of
us are too scared to open up to just anyone. If it's a past person that has
done the work, I think that's a good step in the right direction. For those
that are a bit reluctant to do that.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,
that's amazing. It's um, you'll have to open up like a centre for first
responders in Western Australia, because you don't have one. Yeah,

Steph Bochorsky:

I
know we do need one, don't we? Yeah. That's the thing. You need something like
that. We need to change something.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. I

Steph Bochorsky:

know. And you think of WAI being the wealthy state, so they keep saying, why
isn't there one?

It still astonishes me.

Rosie Skene:

Um, if,
if there was one thing that you could change in relation to how first
responders are supported after traumatic incidents, what would it be? What
would you prioritise?

Steph Bochorsky:

Yeah, so I'm probably going to be, um, pretty blunt in my response here, but
those who sit up high up in positions, um, they need to pay more attention to
the complex issues when it comes to mental health, because to me, protecting
those who protect and serve you should have all the resources thrown at them in
order for them to be supported.

And there will never be change among police officers of those
that are high up in charge. Um, never be part of the solution if they continue
to pull wool over the eyes. Um, this is the attitude that frontline officers
are experiencing and this is why morale is so low and you can see why because,
um, even through conducting some research recently, it's been released that, ,
suicide rate amongst serving police officer has more than doubled in the last
decade.

You don't need to be a rocket scientist to say that something
is very, very wrong here, , and that needs, and something's very wrong with the
number of suicides amongst ranks across the country, and it's going to continue
to rise if our leadership don't get off our high horses, start listening, and
showing a bit of fucking compassion and support, , and not just lip service.

Because. The job is tough enough, but to not care for our own
is the biggest kick in the guts that we all feel, and it's no wonder that
officers are burning out a lot quicker. , cops just want to feel supported by
their own, and this is where the majority are letting us down. So, that would
be my first focus, my first focus would be acknowledging, and seriously
acknowledging, First responders have it tough when it comes to bearing the
mental load and the impacts and show them that they are supported and that they
feel safe and encouraged to go seek help when they're not feeling it.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,

Steph Bochorsky:

that
would be the biggest one. I would think that would be this. Yeah, that's a big
one. Very small startup is show the support, show what you can do, not just
talk about it because we're not feeling it. We're not saying that the
compassion we're not saying the support from any, any of our leadership right
now.

Rosie Skene:

And it's
the same across the state, like across our country for sure. Over here in New
South Wales, it's the exact same story. And you're right. It is the biggest
fucking kick in the guts. When. You go out day after day, do this job and then
you get back to your station and you're in the shit, in the station and there's
no support there from within.

Um, how can people do their jobs properly? One, , if you don't
feel the support and then how, how are they ever going to go seek support if If
they know they're not going to get it, or they're going to get berated, or, um,
you know, career suicide comes into mind, you know, a lot of people don't seek
help because they think that their careers will be over, which is likely
because they get punted into some silly office job, or menial task, or have
their gun locked up, um, yeah, it's got to change, right, from the

Steph Bochorsky:

top.

It does have to change from the top, and that's where we
highlighted before about, um, The realization that mental health still very
much has a stigma attached to it because, you know, you do feel like you looked
at differently. You feel like you're judged, you feel like you're labeled, you
get treated, you feel like you get treated like you can't perform as well as
one of your peers who hasn't been diagnosed with a mental health condition.

And because of this witnessing other members. Um, being treated
so disgracefully when it comes to coming out and saying, I'm, I'm, I need
support. I'm not coping. Um, it, it's no wonder people aren't coming forward
and they're, and they're struggling internally. And I, it really needs to
change.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,

Steph Bochorsky:

the
more we talk about it.

The more that we raise awareness about it, the more that the
stigma will slowly collapse on itself. I find. It's just going to take a lot of
time, unfortunately.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah, I
think so too. I think, and you know, one of the reasons why I want to just do
your podcast and have people like yourself come on is so that we can have these
really open, raw conversations that people don't get privy to, , and so we can
normalise.

What actually happens in, in, you know, moving out of the
police or first responder agencies, , all the shit that happens. Cause we can
talk freely about it. We don't have to watch our backs in relation to those
things that can happen to you. , and I get lots of feedback from people like
these are the conversations that I need to listen to because no one talks about
it enough.

So, I mean, it's been amazing to have you on to have a chat
about it.

Steph Bochorsky:

Yeah, no. And I will say that since going on. You know, not being so scared to
do the work. I have since found out that in order for the light to shine
bright, the darkness must be present. Yes. That's a, that's a quote that was
spoken about and I'm like, I like that.

Yeah. Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

That's
beautiful.

Steph Bochorsky:

Yeah. And we shouldn't, , and we shouldn't feel guilty about seeking help
because yeah, it's not. It's not you giving, seeking help is not giving up,
it's refusing to give up, was another one that I really liked just recently.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,

Steph Bochorsky:

that's so true. We need to remind ourselves of these.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.
Yeah. It's, it can be really tough, right? And I'm, I'm so glad that, um,
you're able to come on and have like this really meaningful conversation with
me and, and share your experiences as deeply traumatic as they are. I really
appreciate you coming on. So thank you so much, Steph.

Steph Bochorsky:

No,
thank you for your time.

Rosie Skene:

I hope
you've enjoyed today's episode. If you have, make sure to hit subscribe so you
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Your support means the world. My name is Rosie Skene join me
again next week for another empowering and positive episode of Triumph Beyond
Trauma. Until then, be kind to your mind and trust in the magic of your
consistent and positive efforts. Triumph Beyond your trauma is closer than you
think. Have the best week.