Rosie Skene:

Hello and welcome to episode 41 of Triumph
Beyond Trauma, the very first episode of Season five. I am so excited to bring
you this incredible conversation with the absolutely wonderful Sonya Leeding,
born in New Zealand, Sonya Leeding and relocated to Australia with her parents
and three siblings. In 1987, Sonya grew up in Logan, Queensland and relocated
to the Gold Coast in 2001.

After completing a double degree, a Bachelor of Arts and
Justice Studies and a Bachelor of Laws. Sonya practiced law for a short time
and found her true passion in policing in 2003. She has been a Queensland
police officer ever since working at Southport Runaway Bay, and eventually
finding a passion and fulfilling a lifelong dream.

Becoming a detective with the Child Protection and
Investigation Unit. Sonya was widowed at 32 years old and has had to adjust to
life on her own as a single mother. Since losing her husband has taught Sonya
many valuable lessons, but most importantly has allowed her

[00:01:00]

resilience to shine through, which is also
evident in her work in the Child Protection Unit.

Sonya's debut book, blue Widow is the journey of how she
navigated life as a police officer after love and loss. It is a journey of
resilience and the discovery that trusting in yourself can be the very thing
that saves you. This story will introduce you to humans behind the badge. When
Sonya is not protecting vulnerable victims, you'll find her in mum mode with
her two children, Hudson and Grace.

Sonya has a passion for baking. It soothes her soul. Sonya's
downtime is spent at a local F 45 gym or out walking with her Labradoodles
Elliot and Amali. Sonya is also a king camper, and with the assistance of her
1968 Viscount Vintage Caravan, Felicia, she manages to find peace and choir at
new locations around Southeast Queensland.

It was truly my privilege to sit down with Sonya and to hear
her journey. Sonya's book Blue Widow is a powerful and beautifully written
memoir and I highly

[00:02:00]

recommend
getting a copy. I will link to her website on the show notes, um, so you can
grab yourself one. Before we dive in, I do wanna acknowledge that this episode
covers very sensitive topics, including postnatal depression, the passing of
Sonya's husband, Damien mental health challenges, and some alcohol abuse.

So please be mindful. Of your own wellbeing today as you listen
and know that it's okay to pause, I'll stop this episode and return to it when
you feel like you might be ready. A huge thank you to Sonya for being so open
and so vulnerable in sharing her journey. She's truly a phenomenal woman and I
am such a better person for , having met her and having had this conversation,
and I cannot wait for you to hear it.

So let's dive in.

Welcome to Triumph Beyond Trauma, the podcast that explores
journeys of resilience and hope. I'm Rosie Skene a

[00:03:00]

yoga and breathwork teacher and founder of Tactical Yoga Australia. As a former
soldier's wife, mum to three beautiful kids, and a medically retired NSW police
officer with PTSD, I understand the challenges of navigating mental health in
the first responder and veteran community.

Join us for incredible stories from individuals who've
confronted the depths of mental illness and discovered their path to happiness
and purpose, as well as solo episodes and expert discussions. Together, we'll
uncover the tools to help you navigate your journey toward a brighter, more
fulfilling life.

Whether you're looking for helpful insights, practical tips, or
just a friendly reminder that you're not alone, Triumph Beyond Trauma has got
your back. You matter and your journey to a happier, more meaningful life
starts right here.

Welcome to the podcast, . I'm stoked that you're here. I just
wanted to start by saying how honored I am that you are here with me.

I really appreciate it. , and your story and the way that you
shared it through your book, Blue Widow

[00:04:00]

is just so powerful and beautiful. And I really loved how raw it was. , and I
hadn't heard you speak before, but I could almost hear your voice coming
through in the book, which is, yeah. Just to make, like, I thought that was
amazing.

Thank you. Yeah. If you want, um, and if you're happy to, do
you want to go back to the beginning, , what inspired you to join the
Queensland Police

Sonya Leeding:

absolutely. So, um, I guess I'm the eldest of four kids, , and I'm the smallest
of all four of them. So, um, when I say smallest, the shortest.

Rosie Skene:

Um, I'm
the, I'm the eldest

and the shortest. What is that?

Sonya Leeding:

I know
we're like the tester kid, I think , , . So being that kid, I was very much a,
you know, let's set this up for the rest of the kids and do the right thing and
be the boss and be a perfectionist and, and do something to prove everyone else
wrong.

So I guess that's kind of how I ended up in policing and the
fact that I always wanted to.

[00:05:00]

You
know, , making a difference in the community was such a massive thing for me.
So it was really something that, , I was drawn towards. In fact, I changed
schools in, , at the end of year 10 and going for an interview at the new
school, they said, Oh, what do you want to do when you leave school?

And I went, Oh, I think, I think I might join the police. And
I'm thinking. I'm probably too short. I'm probably not quick enough. , and I
was, I think at the time they had height restrictions in, so I wouldn't have
made it. I would have like been just under the height limit. , and the
principal said, okay, well you need to do all these subjects.

So it was smart maths, PE, which I didn't do beforehand. , and
I went, oh, yeah, I can do those. So I did them. But I threw in a few creative
subjects as well. You know, I had to do my art and drama and all that sort of
stuff. Cause that's where I was at, uh, and, oh, and legal studies. And it
wasn't until we had, , a guest presenter in our legal studies class who worked
in the Juvenile Aid Bureau at the time.

[00:06:00]

And , she came in
and told us about her life experiences and working in the police. And then I
went, you know what, I think that's what I want to do. So from that, I was
determined that once I left school, I was going to the police. But by the time
I left school, I was like, still the same height. Nothing had changed.

So I started my, , my degree. I did justice. And then I tacked
on a law degree as well, because I thought, well, if I don't get into the
police, I need something to fall back on. , so that was cool and got there and
went, Oh, still want to be a copper. I think, you know, this is the place for
me. And then.

There were quite a few people who, so the justice degree was
three years and there were lots of guys in it who were going to be police
officers. So when I looked at them, they were a good two foot taller than me
and, you know, broad and just built like they should be on the street. Whereas
I was not, so I was like, Oh, I don't know how this is going to happen.

, and I diverted for a little bit. , I got really

[00:07:00]

involved in my law and thought that maybe
the corporate world was where I needed to be. , so eventually. I ended up
finishing my degree, got a job in law, absolutely hated it, and went, I need to
put my application in. But by then I was 23, so I sort of had, you know, a
wealth of knowledge and life experience.

I was married for the first time. Um, yeah, so I'm thinking,
oh, this is great. I'm really mature, all of 23 years old. By the time I was
24, I was accepted and I started the academy.

So, yeah. That was probably a really long winded version of how
I ended up in the police, but that's where I wanted to be. I wanted to serve
and I knew that I wanted to help people.

Um, and I think most of us start with that sort of ideal when
we, when we go to the police.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah, I
agree. Isn't it interesting that you had that little thing inside you from,
like, you had said it right from the start. I think I want to be in the police
and then, yeah, you got it.

Sonya Leeding:

It
just intrigued me. I

[00:08:00]

love the
uniform.

I love the, you know, the paramilitary style that was, Um,
probably advertised back then, it's probably not so much now, but back then,
no, no, no, they don't do that. I can tell you now, when I went through the
Academy, I expected boot camp. Instead, it was an adult learning environment
where they kind of left you to your own devices for your fitness and I was
like, oh, I have to do this myself.

I need someone to tell me

Rosie Skene:

what to
do. I know, I'm the same, like, oh, actually, I was expecting someone to crack
a whip every now and then and make me go and do it.

Sonya Leeding:

Oh, it
was just nuts. But, you know, yeah, that six months was definitely, um. Life
changing, and I would never go back and do it again, especially not 22 years
later.

I couldn't imagine doing it at this age now. Oh my gosh,

Rosie Skene:

I know.
Oh, you, , shared some, like, beautiful moments. I don't want to talk about the
book too much because I reckon people should

[00:09:00]

really read it. It's amazing, but, like, obviously we will talk about it. Yeah.
But you shared such beautiful moments about your relationship with Damien.

Sonya Leeding:

Yes.

Rosie Skene:

In the
book. Um, and I would love to know how you guys, well, I know because I read
the book, but if you could share with everyone, um, how you guys met and, , the
connection, like where did you get that connection from and how did that grow
in your relationship develop?

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah.
Okay. So, um, I better paint a picture of Damien for those who don't know.

I say I'm short, so I'm 163cm and seem to be shrinking by the
day according to my children. Um, and Damien was probably 3cm taller than me.
Yeah. So he wasn't a big fella. Um, but he was fit. And, uh, The first time I
saw him, like we'd seen each other in the halls in the dorms because we're both
living on campus and he was an intake ahead of me.

[00:10:00]

And like I said before, I was married at the time and no, our
relationship didn't start at the Academy, just so everyone knows. I mean,
plenty, plenty of others did that kind of thing, but I didn't. Um, and my
girlfriend and I were practicing the obstacle course one day and Sandy. was
shorter than I am, but she was a really strong, wiry sort of lady.

You know, she could lift heavy and all that sort of stuff. But
running really wasn't her thing. So we went right, I will go practice this
afternoon. So the first obstacle is like a flat Besser brick wall with nothing
to climb up, um, you literally launch yourself at it and over the top. So I was
attempting to do that.

and ran into it a couple of times and was in hysterics and just
being a fool and thinking, oh yeah, I'll get through this eventually, whatever.
I've done it a few times. So I didn't really care. And Sandy was sort of up on
the bank next to the obstacle course and I'm being a

[00:11:00]

dickhead and, and I look over at her and she's going, standing there with her
mouth wide open.

And just staring, and I'm like, what the heck's going on? I'm
thinking, ah, she's not laughing at me, I didn't get any laughs out of her.
She's focused on something else, so I'm like, oh, give up. So I went and joined
her, standing on the bank, and I'm like, what are you looking at? We're meant
to be training. And she's like, that.

And she points down the obstacle course, and there's this red
haired, freckly faced guy who come flying over these obstacles, like, So when I
do it, and when I feel like I do any training, it's clunky and it's heavy.

Damien was so light on his feet. He was bouncing. He was like a
rabbit. It was crazy. So, you know, he'd just leap over these things.

And then he got to the balance beams, and they were those
graduated balance beams. So they started low. Yeah, they started low coming
back because he was on the return lap. And he was running across it. And I'm
like, Okay.

[00:12:00]

Who the fuck is this
guy? This is insane, how do you do that? Like, I'm like, I'm thinking, Huh,
maybe I should just give up now.

Like, he was just so fit and then gets to the besser brick wall
and just leaps over it and I'm like, Huh, okay, I guess that's how it's
supposed to be done. That's how you

Rosie Skene:

do it,
yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah,
so that was my first sighting of him and I was like, That guy's insane. And
then after that, we'd sort of pass in the halls, and you know, I knew a few of
his intake, um, just to chat to, but other than that, we really didn't say a
word to each other than hi, how you going, and I, I knew him as Damo.

Um, and so since then, I found out that his nickname at the
academy from his squad mates was Stiffy. Cause he's always out in front. As
derogatory as that is, it's a typical copper thing, isn't it? The most stupid
nickname you could find. And he had it,

[00:13:00]

you know, nothing to do with his red hair.

So he grew up with the nickname spud from his mates. And I
can't recall how that one came about, but at the academy it was

Rosie Skene:

Stiffy
that's so funny. I love, I love how the, yeah, police humour works, you know.

Sonya Leeding:

Oh,
it's ridiculous. And I'm sure there are other professions that have that kind
of, um, banter, I guess.

But, yeah, obviously I haven't worked in any, so I'm just
saying it's a cop thing. Yeah. Um, yeah, so then we graduated, he graduated two
months before I did. Um, we both posted to the Gold Coast and, um, I was
working, I'd done a rotation through Broadbeach Station and then Coomera and
then was in my last six months of my first year at Southport and, uh, that's
where we met and it was like, Um, you know, he was just another guy in the day
room.

Obviously he stood out because of his red hair, because
obviously there aren't many people with red hair around. Oh, you're that
redhead

[00:14:00]

copper, that guy from the
academy and whatever. And so by the time I got to Coomera, I was like three
months into my first year and my marriage had fallen apart, , mostly because of
the job, because we just, didn't see eye to eye on how things should be.

And yeah, it was young love that, you know, perhaps shouldn't
happen, but it did. And whatever we, we got through that. And yeah, so by then,
by the time I actually met Damien, I was single. So, um, yeah, it just started
with banter in the day room. You know, I was just one of the guys as they, you
know, as we all sort of got along and, um, we didn't actually work together
because we were both still in our first year.

And then. Towards the end of my first year, he was finishing up
and he actually got posted to Mount Isa. Oh. Yeah, so, um, he managed to do a
swap with someone at Surfers Paradise and ended up posted there for his first

[00:15:00]

posting. And, um, along the Great Vine, he
had heard that my flatmate, who I was living with at the time, was moving out.

And, , He'd sent me a text message and I'm like, and back then
it was like the old phones, the push button. Yeah. No photos, no nothing,
really plain. Um, and he sent me this text message saying, Hey, I hear you've
got a room for rent. I want to move out of the barracks. And I'm like, Jesus,
news travels fast around here.

How did you get my number? Back when computer hacking wasn't a
thing. Um, you know, and you could look up whoever you wanted on this, , a
system and. Plenty of people got in trouble for it, but yeah, , I'm like, oh,
yeah, okay. I need someone to help pay the rent. So he moved in after that and
I suppose the rest is history.

You know, we started with that friendship and yeah, it was
just, we'd hang out together and he'd go out with his mates and I'd go out with
my girlfriends. And

[00:16:00]

then, you know,
the next morning it'd be like, hey, how you going? And yeah, we just, you know.
We just really built that friendship. Um, and we had that time to do that,
which was really nice.

Um, and I don't think a lot of relationships necessarily these
days have that basis. You don't have that time to get to know each other. Um,
you know, life's changed. It's all technology driven. Whereas, because we were
living around each other, we kind of got over the whole, Oh, this is a bit
weird kind of thing, trying to get used to someone else.

Whereas we were very open from the start. , and, um, As
friends, and then obviously that grew into love. So yeah, that's how our
relationship started

Rosie Skene:

so nice.
And I like that. You know how back in the old days before all the technology
could time and just build friendships and feeling pressure.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

When did
you get married?

Sonya Leeding:

Um,
the 6th of May 2006. So we'd been together for 9 months and then he proposed.
And, um. It wasn't,

[00:17:00]

well, it was a
surprise because we talked about it for ages. And I was like, Oh yeah, whatever
he's going to do it whenever. And I really didn't care either way. Cause I knew
that we were going to be together.

So it didn't matter whether it was official or not. , but he'd
asked my dad, so we got engaged in the. August 2005. And he must have asked my
dad earlier in the year. So mum and dad were living in Victoria at the time and
they'd been up for a holiday and he'd asked dad. So every time we went on like
a little mini break, we'd go away for the weekend, my parents would ring
excitedly up and say, have you got any news?

So, you know, , he took his time, which is what he always did.
He did it in his own way with no pressure. And yeah, it was, it was a surprise.
, that he was actually doing it. So that was great. Um, so yeah, we got engaged
and then we got married nine months after that. But

Rosie Skene:

yeah. .
Yeah. Beautiful. I love that about your parents, like, Oh, is it now?

And then when we finally ring, they're like, Oh, it's about
time.

[00:18:00]

They've just stopped calling.
Yes.

Sonya Leeding:

She'll
let him know. Yes. But no, everyone was very excited that it was finally
official. Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

And you
welcomed your little boy. Yeah. Yeah. How was that? Um, planning a baby because
I remember, you know, you saying that you weren't sure that you were ready.

Yeah. to have a baby yet Yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

So
almost as soon as we got together, um, Damien was like, let's have a baby. And
I'm like, let's not, I'd rather go nightclubbing. I don't want to have a baby.
I'm too young. Yeah. , and I was very career driven as well. Like I really
wanted to make the most of, , being a copper and making my mark on the world
and saving as many people as I could, which, you know, wears off after a few
months.

Um, and each year you become less and less enamored by that
prospect. Yeah. So, um, yeah, at the

[00:19:00]

time, like I was, I'd come out of my first year. I was permanent at Southport
Station and someone there had seen some ability in me to investigate. So I was
put in the enquiries team straight away with some really experienced officers.

And I thought, Oh, this is neat. You know, I don't want to go
having a baby and ruining all of this. Um, so it did take us a little while to
get there. to come around to the fact that, yeah, we were going to have a kid.
And not saying that I'm not maternal, because I was always very maternal and
always wanted kids, but after I joined the police, I went, I don't know, I've
just got this amazing career, and I don't want to go and, and have a baby and
divert it.

So anyway, we did eventually have Hudson in 2009. But, you
know, that wasn't without its trials as well. So, I know lots of, and I'm not
being disrespectful, but I know lots of people have, , fertility issues and
those sorts of things. And I just wasn't sure that my body was capable of

[00:20:00]

it. Yeah. And it took us 13 months to fall
pregnant.

And then when I did, it was like, Oh, we're right on your 30th
birthday, happy birthday. No drinks for you. Yeah. So we planned this massive
party and I was like. I'm just going to do a test before I run off and do my
errands for the day and just see whether I should be having champagne on the
weekend or not.

So, did the test, waited the time, came back in, checked it and
went, oh shit. I'm pregnant and I literally didn't have time to celebrate or
anything. Um so Damien was still in bed so I ran and I threw the test at him
and I went here you go. Hey we're having a baby. I've gotta go. I've got all
this stuff to do and he's like huh?

Pee stick in his face
like you know. Yeah. We're having a child.

Rosie Skene:

Oh my
god.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah.
So um having to keep that a secret while everyone Yeah, and most of them were
police mates, you know, , I don't know if you had that experience, but every
time

[00:21:00]

we got together there was a
ridiculous amount of booze.

Everyone just went crazy, you know? So, I was not crazy this
time. I just watched everybody else do it. Um, and everyone was like, oh, do
you want another drink? So I'm going to be like, yeah, yeah, yeah. So they'd
get me a champagne, and I'd go, thanks, and wait for them to walk away. I'd put
it down and walk off.

Rosie Skene:

Ah,
because I was going to ask, yeah, because every time I was pregnant, everyone
knew, because I would just stop drinking.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah,
yeah. So I caught, um, like the non alcoholics, Sparkling. So I had a glass
with something in it, but I didn't know what it was. Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

That's
the easiest way to tell. I didn't even know how far along I was.

. So yeah, Huddo came along in 2009 and Again, that was another
life altering experience, um, when you think you got the mummy gene and then
you go, oh, this is not what it cracked up to be. Um, life was very different
considering, you know, I wanted to work and it was nothing like policing. It
was a whole other ball game, , where you had someone

[00:22:00]

completely relying on you for everything.

It was just so, so different.

And that took me a real lot to get used to. So, um, yeah, we
managed to do that though. And I think the best part was that I got onto it
very quickly. , I'd always suffered depression from when I was about 15. So it
had been something that had been in and out of my life anyway.

I just didn't think it would happen. I didn't think I'd get
postnatal at all. I thought, oh, I'm just going to be in this love bubble with
this baby. And then no sleep and the whole complete change of life. And you're
just like, oh. And I said to Damien one night, I said, I actually resent him.
And he said, what do you mean?

Because all he wanted was Our baby. Yeah. And I said, I just
resent how my life's changed and how I can't do anything without having to
consider him and and he is just the focus of everything and I I don't wanna do
that. And he went, what do you mean you don't wanna do it? I said, I I actually
can't. I feel sick.

And so

[00:23:00]

it got to a point where obviously with the
lack of sleep and and what have you. I went driving around with Hudson in the
car looking for a truck to drive under. and that kind of, because he was
screaming so much, I was just like driving around all these back roads, and the
roads that I still travel now, every time I drive past a particular street, I'm
like, thank God that was a really steep hill, because there's probably no way
there'd be a truck up there that I could have driven under anyway, and I was
going at like 30k, so it wouldn't have made any impact.

It would have just damaged both of us. , Yeah, so I literally
drove up this hill, up the panorama, drove across the top, looked out and went,
I know what, I'm going to go to Rabina Town Centre. So I went there, Hudson
kept screaming and screaming, I thought, okay, I'll take him in, he might
settle, and put him in the pram, and I just remember feeling like everyone was
staring at me, and , yeah, walking through with this screaming child, these
people staring at me.

And thinking, holy crap,

[00:24:00]

I've failed. I can't do this. Like, I can't do this. It's too hard. And so, I
didn't even feed him. I just walked in and walked out. Packed him in the car
and drove to my mum's and said, I can't do this anymore. Like, I was a mess. I
was bawling my eyes out. I just gave my dad Hudson and he walked up and down
the hallway with him.

And I said, I just can't do it. So they settled me that day.
And then I went home that night. Damien was on an afternoon shift. And, , by
the time I'd got home from being calm to getting in the house, Hudson had
started crying again. And that just set me off again. And I put him down in the
middle of the room and I walked away and I went, I'm not touching this kid
because if I do, something's going to go really wrong.

So I rang my mum. I said, you need to come up. I said, my mum
or my dad? I think it might have been Dad, because him and I have always had a
really good bond, and my mum as well, like, I can't fault them for anything.
Um, but yeah, I remember putting Hudson down, and

[00:25:00]

then one of them rang Damien and said, you probably need to come home, mate,
and we need to, you know, get some supports happening and what have you.

And still, I think that was probably a turning point for me, ,
and that I went, okay, I've identified that this is making me feel really
awful. How am I going to start to manage myself so that I can be a better mum

and so that Hudson has everything he needs? And, , we managed
to settle him that night and settle myself.

And the next day I went, right, I've got to start, , working on
my own mindset. I didn't end up seeking any professional help because I didn't
want to be put on any medication. Um, But I went like, okay, what were things
that brought me joy? And in the end, I'll be like, I'm not going to clean the
house. Okay, cool.

I'm going to put him in the front pack. I'm going to put some
music on and we're going to dance and we're going to do it this way because
that's what used to bring me joy.

[00:26:00]

As
a kid, I dance. So that was, you know, my favorite thing to do. I'm like,
right. And this is going to be good for me too. And then in the afternoons,
like if Demo was at work during the day, he'd come home, come on, we'll go for
a walk.

Because we had a shepherd then as well. So she'd need a walk.
And unfortunately for me, we lived in a place that whichever way you went out
the street was a hill. Yeah. Do you want the pram or do you want the dog? And
I'd be like. I'll take the dog, you can take the pram.

Rosie Skene:

The dog
can pull you up the hill.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah,
and she did because she'd never walk with us, she'd always walk out in front.
But yeah, eventually it was just that going, okay, this is my life now. , I
don't have to feel bad about it. Your body was made to have children. You were
obviously meant to be a mother. Where's, where's the disconnect? And I went, I
think, , being in the police, was something that I'd wanted to do for such a
long time and I wasn't willing to give it up necessarily.

Um,

[00:27:00]

and then, yeah,
having Hudson and being at home all the time, I was like, that's not what I
really want to do. And so I think I only spent four or five months on maternity
leave and went back. So yeah, that was, , the struggle having him. And he says
to me sometimes, he's like, Mum because he started reading my book , Grace
hasn't because she's not much of a reader, but Hudson started reading it and I
think he got up to one of the parts. Uh, yeah, I might have been kissing Damien
or something in one of the parts, and he goes, Oh, Mum I don't think I want to
read that.

Yeah, skip that chapter. Just move on. Now it sounds like it's
an adult novel. But yeah, he was like, I didn't know that you suffered
depression from when you were really young. And I said, Yeah, mate. He said,
Oh, and I think it was sort of a light bulb moment for him because he watches
me now and he knows.

When I'm not feeling well, , and he's also very conscious

[00:28:00]

of, , his own mental health, which is
really good. So, I'm sort of like, mate, keep reading it. It goes through the
really hard parts and then you kind of come out the end. There is a light at
the end of the tunnel. But yeah, he's, , yeah, it's, he's probably shaped me, ,
With a lot of my managing my depression, so yeah,

Rosie Skene:

I think
like listening to you talk about becoming a Mum for the first time and being a
police officer and really loving your job, I can relate to that a lot and we
had our first baby and I didn't have any postnatal or anything like that.

I was very lucky. But, , that sense that I was missing out.
Yeah. It's like FOMO, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. And then we tried for a
second baby and it didn't happen. and then, so I put in for a remote transfer,
which was great, but then I fell pregnant obviously immediately after something
that happens and, uh, the guilt that I had for the new like station, but then I
was like,

[00:29:00]

you know, I was on my way
to maybe promotion and all of those things.

And I was just like, Oh, that's. That's over for me now. Like I
had this pre, I had this like pre baby sadness, like it was probably a little
bit of depression too and even like I was really early in the pregnancy, but
yeah, I just remember feeling like, oh, I just don't really want this for me at
the moment.

Sonya Leeding:

I
know, they've had the most inopportune times.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,
there's never a good time though, is there, to have one.

Sonya Leeding:

No,
there really isn't. And, you know, looking at it now, I'm sort of going, well,
when, when was I supposed to do it? Like, I'd been in the job for six years
when I had Hudson. Um, and then. Yeah, I suppose if I move on a little bit, the
next part of our story is having Grace.

So Hudson was nine months old when I fell pregnant with her,
and she was a surprise. So we'd sort of planned like a two year gap, best laid
plans, right?

[00:30:00]

Um, and so we've been
out for dinner with my colleagues from Runaway Bay Station. And it was, . It
must have been, I don't know, I can't even think of what it was.

Anyway, , I would sat down and they're like, do you want a
glass of wine? I'm like, yeah, I'll just have one. I think I was driving that.
I said to Damo, I don't really feel like it, which is most unheard of. And I'm
drinking this wine and I'm going. Oh, that tastes weird. What's wrong with the
wine? And they're looking at me going, are you being serious?

Yeah. And then dessert came out. It was sticky date pudding.
I'm like, you can't get that wrong. And I went, Oh, it's just this weird taste
in my mouth. And then I had a race day that weekend and like a police legacy
race day. And I've been looking forward to it for ages. And again, I was like,
ordinarily I would have had a big day because I've been feeling off.

I'll just do a test. Let's just

[00:31:00]

see what happens. So I do a pregnancy test and put it down. It hadn't even, it
wasn't even close to the time limit. And you know how there's like the control
line that comes up to say that the test is working? That hadn't even come up.
The positive line came up straight away.

And then the control line came in slowly and I'm like It's just
like different. What's going on here? And I'm like, oh shit, I want to go and
have a really nice day tomorrow with my girlfriends. I've got the outfit ready,
you know, ready for bubbles. And I'm thinking, how am I going to do this? I've
got a nine month old baby and I'm going to have another baby.

Are you kidding me? Especially after having postnatal
depression, I was like, Oh, Oh, the trains just got back on the tracks. I just
can't, I can't do this. And then I went, Oh, I'll just forget about it for the
weekend. It'll be fine. So I dropped Hudson off to my mum's because she was
looking after him for the night.

And she goes,

[00:32:00]

Should
you be drinking this weekend? And I'm like, Yeah, I'm fine. What are you
talking about? And she's like, Oh, nothing. I'm like, Hmm. She knows. So I went
and had a nice weekend. And I I had a couple of bubbles and I'm sitting next to
my best mate, Trudy, and I go, I had a glass of champagne in my hand, and I go,
I lean over and I said, um, I have something to tell you.

She's like, what? I said, I think I'm pregnant. She goes, what
are you drinking that for? And I went, cause, I don't know, um, I'm just having
a nice weekend. And I think I probably had two. two, maybe three. Grace always
says to me, Oh, that's what's wrong with me. No, darling, it's not. You would
have been not even the size of a pea.

So don't worry about it. Um, yeah, sure enough. Yep, I was
definitely pregnant and probably a bit further on than we thought, so.

Rosie Skene:

Oh wow.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah.

[00:33:00]

Big surprise. Like, yeah, um, the first
scan we went to, I'm like, oh, they're like, oh, you should be about eight
weeks. Well, I was 12 weeks. I'm thinking, why am I so big? You sure there's
only one in there?

And they're like, yep. Wow. Just the one, but you're further
along, I mean, okay, great. So yes, uh, 18 months after we had Hudson, Grace
came along.

Rosie Skene:

Wowee.
In your book, you've got a birthday in there, and it's actually two days before
I had my first baby.

Sonya Leeding:

Oh,
really?

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.
That was his due date, actually, when she was born.

Yeah, well, she came

Sonya Leeding:

on her
due date. Okay, yeah. Yeah. We were like, this baby just does not want to get
out. My obstetrician kept going, she's got no room. If you're there in a week's
time, we're going to have to do something. I'm like, okay. So I went to her on,
no, it was on Damien's birthday. I went and saw her and she manipulated bubs to
see if we could bring on the labor.

Cause I'm thinking, oh, on a due date, really? Like maybe don't
come on your dad's birthday or your

[00:34:00]

pa's birthday, which is the day after. There was a day in between, we had a
day's window. Um, So I got home from the obstetrician and I'm like, Damo, come
on, we're going for, we're doing blocks around our place.

Get Hudson in his little bike thing and off we went and took
the dog. And he's like, are you all right? I'm like, yeah, I've got a couple of
pains. Took him out for dinner for his birthday up Tamborine Mountain and he
literally chased Hudson up and down the resort where we went to all night. And,
um, got home and I was like, oh.

still feel a bit funny. I'm just going to go to sleep. And when
we'd had Hudson, I labored from 6pm till, and he was born at 6am. So it was all
overnight. And then Damien said to me, Do you reckon this time you could like,
let me sleep? And I'm like, Oh, because it's all about you. Okay, so 340 in the
morning, I went to the bathroom.

Well, my waters broke as soon as I went in

[00:35:00]

there. And I went, Oh, That didn't happen
last time. Maybe this is going to be a bit quicker. And I'm like, I'm not going
to the hospital because I don't want to sit there and carry on. I just wanted
to wait until we're just about to pop before I went. And, um, so I had a shower
and went, Oh, put fresh, um, nightie on what have you, went back to bed and had
some work up a few hours later and He's running, I got up and made him his
breakfast.

He's running around the kitchen and carrying on. And then I
went, Oh, uh oh, that doesn't feel right. I think we're having contractions.
And it was so quick. And I rang my parents and said, Hey, cause they were
living out of timber and said, yeah, can you come down? , I'm in labor. Don't
panic. My water's broke.

I think. And anyway, I'm just waiting on Damien to get out of
bed. So then I went, Oh, maybe I should tell him that I'm, I'm in labor. You
know, we're having a baby now. Just wake him up. Um, excuse me. Hey babe. Um,

[00:36:00]

my water's broke at whatever time. What?
Your water's broke? Should we not be at the hospital? I'm like, nah, I'm all
right.

I'll tell mom and dad to come, but not to hurry. Grace had
other ideas. Um, so, I went, okay, I said Hudson's fed, I've got a bag packed,
he's all good to go. By the time my parents arrived, and ordinarily it's
probably like a 20 minute drive, if that, from where they live down to where we
were. Um, by the time mum and dad arrived, I was on all fours in our bedroom,
and our bedroom's right next to the front door.

And my dad at the time was a paramedic, and he literally walked
past, stuck his head in, and said to Demo, You might want to get her up into
the hospital, because I reckon if you don't do that soon, she's having the baby
right there. And Damien's like, Sonya you've got to get up! And I'm like, I
need to put a bra on, and, um, I've got, and he goes, Oh, for God's

[00:37:00]

sake.

So he's like raving me up off the floor, trying to get me into
the car. And my mum's like, Are you all right, love? I'm like, Yeah, I just
didn't want to do all that at the hospital. And they're looking at me like,
What the fuck? You know, you should have been there probably a few hours ago.
Anyway, we, um, we get in the car.

I'm in the backseat on all fours the whole way. We hit a. I
remember having a face washer and thinking this is not cold enough, put on my
head. That didn't work. And we're driving along and ordinarily to get to the
highway from our place, there's this street, Michigan drive that you go down,
but it's got speed bumps every interval.

And I'm thinking, oh, Damo, just go down there. No, he would
not go down there in case we went over a bump and I had baby in the backseat of
his Jeep. On the leather seats, can't have that. So we drove all the way out to
the highway, and then off we went. And I'm like, we're driving along, and I
remember sticking my head up going, why aren't we there yet?

Can you

[00:38:00]

stop going
the long way? I'm having this baby now. And then when he pulls up, he pulled
up. So at Pindarra, there's like a, at the entrance, there's, you know, the
emergency, you jump in and you can go straight in. No, no, he didn't do that.
He pulled up across the road. And my mom goes, um. Came in, she's like
literally ready to drop this kid.

She's going to have a contraction in the middle of the road if
you park there. And he's like, oh, oh yeah, oh. And I'm thinking, you're this
like fantastic copper, and he really was. And your brain's not working when
your wife's having a baby. What's going on? So then he pulls into the emergency
and goes, I can't leave the car here.

So mum walked me in and the people at reception go, Do you know
where you're going love? And I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah. I had no idea where I
was going. I just knew I was going down the hallway somewhere. I get partway
down the hallway and back on the floor again. And so Damien went round the back
of the hospital to find a park and I think he literally made it into the labour
room.

With like five

[00:39:00]

minutes to spare before Grace was actually born, she was in a hurry. Yeah,

Rosie Skene:

that's
incredible. How amazing how relaxed you are about the whole thing. I should be
right.

Sonya Leeding:

Well,
yeah, we've Hudson. I was like, uh, you know, when you go to antenatal classes,
like, I'll have a plan and I'm thinking. Have a plan, you're having a baby.

So I had a plan, and nothing went to plan, so I'm like, this
time I'm like, I'm not having a plan, but I'm not going to the hospital, it's
as simple as that. So it was, um, yeah, she was here in a hurry, and she was
perfect, and, um, she came on her due date, and literally I had her, I got up
and I had a shower, and then the midwife comes in and goes, she looks at me and
she goes.

Did you just have a baby? I went, yeah, my husband's got her.
She goes, but you're already dressed. And I said, yeah, the mess is all over
there. We're all sitting here. I'm hungry. Can I have something to eat? So in
terms of pregnancies and births,

[00:40:00]

I'm
like, that's a really great way to start her life. Um, whereas Hudson, I was,
um, I was quite sick with a chest infection.

I couldn't breathe half the time. So pushing him out was a
mission. And in the end, they had to take him out with forceps. The plan that I
had was not that. Whereas with her I went, I'm not doing this and I'm not doing
that and you know, I didn't want an epidural and I didn't want anything and
thank God she was quick is all I can say.

So yeah, that was the plan just to not go to the hospital. Just
don't do that. I want to have the baby at home, but I don't want to be there
laboring either. Yeah, we'll just get there right on time, which you did. What
a great plan. Yeah, yeah, pretty much. And then they're like, Oh. Because it
was a private hospital, Damien's like, So, you gonna come home if they let you?

And I went, No, no, I'm staying here for the five days. I said,
someone can cook my meals and someone else can clean and then I just get time
with Grace, that's it. So I went, and he's like, Oh. So, you're not coming
home? I went,

No.

So yeah,

[00:41:00]

a complete
different, start for her as it was to Hudson. Like the birth didn't go the way
I wanted it. The sleep was no good. Whereas Grace slept and often people would
come over and go, do you have a baby? And I'm like, yeah, yeah, your house is
spotless and there's no noise. I mean, yeah, she's asleep.

I can even go in there with the vacuum and she won't move.
Yeah. And she's still the same. Like she'll fall asleep next to massive
speakers with music going and she's yeah, she's just one of those kids.

Rosie Skene:

And how,
how did you go with your postnatal for Grace's early days? Or were you more of
it or she was just an easier baby?

Sonya Leeding:

She
was an easy baby. That's what I was saying. You know, the start to her life was
very different. And because I had Hudson already, I think knowing that I went,
Oh, I already did it. And I did it the hard way. Probably made it easier
transitioning to two kids. And I know, you know, it's only two kids, but. It
was a lot.

When, when you

[00:42:00]

have
postnatal and you go, I was like, I need to have things in place to make sure
that that doesn't happen again. Um, and a lot of that, again, was mindset. Um,
and going, right, what are my triggers? What, what do I need to keep doing? So,
you know, keeping active and all that sort of stuff. So yeah, when I was
pregnant with her, I think I did Zumba till I was about.

28 weeks pregnant with her until I could no longer move my
hips, um, because, yeah, I was just all baby with her, um, and then having
Hudson, you know, to keep me busy and grounded instead of going, oh, because
I'd only been back at work part time for a few months, so it was like, oh,
well, whatever. Um, that's where I'm going to be when I get back.

Excuse me.

Yeah, so it was just a really different time with her.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,
that's so nice though. . And I guess it helps enjoy that whole

[00:43:00]

period too, doesn't it? When they're just
so little. Like, yeah, it's so fast. Yeah,

Sonya Leeding:

yeah.
So yeah, that was, um, lovely. And I think Damien only had like a couple weeks
off, if that, just to make sure we're all good.

So yeah, I was like, no, you can go back to work. I'm fine on
my own. Yeah, he was like, Oh, I didn't even get a look in with this one. I'm
like, no, no, we're good. I've got this down pat now. I've done it once and I
know what happens. So it's not a big surprise.

Rosie Skene:

I think.
Like I said, you know, I had my little boy at the same time that you had Grace
and I remember it very clearly because I was on maternity leave and also being
a police officer as well. Um, but when you're ready, we can talk about it. And
I just, I can't even imagine, like, I'm one of those. I'm a real empath.

Like, I immediately put myself into someone else's position. I
remember seeing you on TV, of course, because, you know, the story was
everywhere. But I just felt absolutely shattered

[00:44:00]

for you and the family. And can you share what that experience was like for you
and how you even process that immediate shock of what happened when you,
obviously, as we just talked about living in such a beautiful bubble.

Sonya Leeding:

And we
were at that particular point in time. And, um, now like we're 14th year
without Damien and looking back at that, I'm like, You know, have we have stuck
to the plan and not had grace until further down the track? I either A,
wouldn't have her at all, or BI would've had her, had to have her on my own,
like without him.

Um, and I just, I'm like, I'm thankful that we had that time
that we had together. 'cause we had a, like our first family holiday, family of
four in March that year as well. Um, so we'd not long been back from that, and
everything was good, and Damien, you know, he

[00:45:00]

just thrived on his work, he absolutely loved it.

Um, you know, often I'd take Hudson before I had Grace for a
drive, and I'd see these unmarked cars pulled up in the bush somewhere, and I'd
be like, What the heck? What are they doing now? Like, really? And then I'd,
you know, wait till we got home, and I'd text Damien and go, Hey! How's your
shift going? Oh, can't talk right now.

I'm doing, you know, some drug sting. I'll be like, oh my god,
okay. I wonder what you were doing in the bush back there. I said, oh, I drove
past on my way to Zarafa's. You know, like, So, yeah, it was, yeah, life was
really good. It was, yeah, Leeding up to having Grace and then having Grace,
um, We'd just fallen into that beautiful rhythm of having a family and being a
family.

And, um, so, the day it happened, so it was the 29th of May,
2011. And, um, I'd,

[00:46:00]

Damien was on
night work and I'd arranged to go and stay with my mum for, I think it was the
Saturday night, must have been the night before because the 29th was a Sunday,
um, So the Saturday night I'd stayed so that he could have some rest.

Not, I mean, not that Grace was a noisy kid because she'd slept
through from six weeks old. It was just Hudson probably banging around with a
truck or, you know, doing boy stuff as he did. Um, and so we got and stayed up
there on the Saturday night and. Um, mom and I were going to my sister's for a
body shop at home party.

I remember this. Yeah, yeah. Um, so we organized to do that.
But about lunchtime I started to get cramps in my stomach and I'm like, Oh,
maybe I'm coming down with a virus or something and maybe I'm not well. And and
then my stomach was really upset and I said to Mum like I was lying on the
floor with the kids hoping that lying on the floor would, you know, help the
cramps and

[00:47:00]

ease it.

Um, and it just didn't. I said, I just don't feel right.
Something's not right. And I was like, okay, well, we'll go anyway. The kids
are fine. We promised Christy I'd go and I'm driving down the hill and I'm
like, I've got to stop. So I had to stop at the bathroom and go again. And that
was like, right off. We went up to Christie's.

I didn't really feel like it still had these cramps and it was
just this really odd feeling. And funnily enough, on the way there, we drove
past our street. Where Damien would have been asleep, and then on the way back
drove past, and I think he was on, on the Sunday night, he was on a 6P shift,
so, you know, I didn't go back home until later that afternoon after I'd had
dinner.

With mum and dad, um, got home, put Hudson to bed, and then fed
Grace, and I felt like I was, once I was home, I was like, oh, I'm okay. It's
okay. Everything's settled. I'm at home. I've got the kids. I remember sitting
feeding Grace in our lounge room in that house, um, in the front lounge room
and had

[00:48:00]

a few of the lights off, had
some of us settled for the night.

And I was like, oh,

this is how it should be. Damien will be home at two o'clock in
the morning. It was, yeah, it was really peaceful. And

then, um, obviously put her to bed, went to bed myself and
went, okay. I sent Damien a text, um, to, you know, I wished him a good night,
told him I love him, and, and that was it, I guess, um, and then there was the
knock on the door, and, I don't even know, it's like the movies, um, the minute
you see a fully dressed police officer standing at your door.

And when I say dressed, I mean, like, tunic and everything tied
the whole lot. I'm like, Oh, you've got to be kidding me. This is not good. Um,
it's really, it's very surreal. And I can still see Gary's face on the other
side of the glass on our, at our front door. And, you know, the

[00:49:00]

first knock sort of jolts you out of your
sleep and then I'm like, and I kept going and I'm thinking, what the heck's
going on here?

I'm like, Damien's not meant to be finished yet because I think
it was around midnight, maybe. So I'm thinking he's early. Oh, maybe the garage
doors, something's wrong with the garage door and he hasn't got keys. And, you
know, your brain starts trying to rationalize why someone is knocking on your
front door.

And then obviously seeing Gary, I was like, Oh. This isn't
good. And then I said, I looked out and I'm like, you could see Toddy and Jules
behind them. And he's like, open the door. Oh, I forgot to mention we had our
mag torch, you know, the big black one. Yeah. So that was always under the bed.
Yeah. In case we needed a torch or a bludgeon.

Yeah. Depending on the size. Both on both ends. Yeah. Yeah. Um,
so I grabbed that and I'm flashing it through and I'm looking going. I didn't
turn any lights on. I was like, Oh, no, if I don't open it and they can't tell
me

[00:50:00]

what they're here to tell me.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

Um,
and that realization that, you know, they've come to do as people refer to it,
the death knock.

It's like, uh, this, yeah, this is not going to end well. And.
So I let them in and, um, they all get going. So I need to sit down. We need to
talk. I'm not sitting down. You can tell me now. I'm not sitting down. I know
what you're here for. You know, you know what they're doing. Yeah, you know,
I've, I've done it myself where I've knocked on people's door and the first
thing you say is please sit down so you don't fall over.

Yeah. You know, what you don't say so you don't fall over, but
that's it. Yeah, that's right. The measures you take to make sure that that
person's going to be okay. Um, so yeah, we're sitting down and. And Gary told
me that Damien had been shot. And so it's, it's quite strange talking about it
now. Um, and especially after writing my book, I was able to let a lot of

[00:51:00]

that pain go.

Um, so yeah, sitting with Gary and seeing Toddy and Jules and
Toddy in his red friggin polo shirt. Um, and yeah. Gary's saying, oh, we don't
know where he's been shot, but he's at the hospital. And I'm thinking, he's at
the hospital, he's not dead yet. I'm aware, I'm aware. Tell me where. And, and
thinking, please say it's just a leg.

And then I think they won't be here if it's just a leg. Well,
they would have, but probably not in such a, um, a formal capacity, I guess.
And then, cause he wouldn't really, not that he wouldn't answer, he's obviously
doing it to protect me. And that's what you do, but. Then I go into cop mode.
Oh, is it? And I start rattling off all these crooks names and he's like, no,
it's nothing.

Oh, he was chasing him last week. So, and he's looking at me
like, and I'm going, well, and then I went, oh, well, have you got the guys who
did it?

[00:52:00]

And he's like, there's
people in custody. And I went, okay. And then I'm thinking. What do I have to,
what do I do now? And he's like, okay, well, we need to get to the hospital.

I'm like, okay, um, I don't even know how we ended up from the
lounge into the kitchen and then my girlfriend Trudy and another girlfriend
turned up to look after the kids and they'd obviously heard on the grapevine
because, you know, the police service, bad news spreads like wildfire and
everyone who was on that night heard it happen over the radio.

Okay. So, Trude's had been called by one of my mates, who I
work with at Runners, um, and she was already there, so I didn't have to call
her, and I'm like, what are you doing here? She goes, oh, we're here to look
after the kids because you have to go to the hospital, and I'm like, yeah, so
she knew already what had happened.

And so I'm standing at the bench going, oh. Okay, who do

[00:53:00]

you need to call, Gary? Like, I need to
get mum and dad down. Mum, mum will come and she'll just look after the kids
and I'll go with dad and we'll just sort it out and it'll be fine. Um, so I
gave him dad's number and he went outside and spoke to my dad and obviously
told him what had happened and where Damien had been shot.

So dad being a paramedic was like, oh, this is, this is not
good. Um, and, and then I'm in the kitchen trying to organise the kids like,
Oh, Grace, Grace fed at, you know, eight o'clock and she should sleep through
but I've only got like one lot of express milk in the freezer and, and the
girls are like, it doesn't matter, it'll be fine, we'll sort it out.

And I'm like standing there holding my boobs going, um, she'll
be due soon, you know, like this, straight into mum mode and then Gary came
back in and said mum and dad are on their way. I went, okay, great. Who else do
you need to call? And I just started rambling off phone numbers and he was
sitting there going, I don't know how to catch half of that.

So, you know, like, I'm like, oh, there's this person and that
person and, you know,

[00:54:00]

you need to
call some other family. And then my family, um, mum and dad had obviously
called them straight away. So, um, eventually mum and dad arrived and I'm like
to mum, oh, you stay here with the girls and look after the kids.

And mum's like, um, no, I'm coming to the hospital with you.
And I'm like, and then they go, oh, this is. Not what I think it is, is it? And
they're like, yeah, , we all need to go. So off we went to the hospital. And
again, Gary, in his wisdom, didn't take Michigan Drive because it's got speed
bumps. That's great.

We had, well, we're in an unmarked V Dub golf, and there's five
of us in it. So mum and dad and I squished into the backseat. Toddy's in the
front with Gary. And, , yeah, off we go. And I'm going, can you drive faster,
Gary? Can you drive faster? Like, this is a traffic, a run marked traffic car.
Can you put the lights and sirens on?

We need to get there. But the streets were dead. Like, there

[00:55:00]

was no traffic. There was absolutely no
one around until we got to the hospital. And there were people everywhere. And
I was like, oh, shit. This is like bigger than me because I was like, no, I'm
going to deal with this and I'll, I'll, you know, shut it down and everything's
going to be fine.

I'll go there and I'll fix Damien. It'll be fine. We'll come
home and nothing's going to change. Well, everything changed. Um, we got there
and we were told that there was an armed robbery, , at the tavern. Well, they,
sorry, they had already told me that part and that Damien had been shot. And
once we got into the family room at the hospital, , we had to wait for the
surgeon who was operating on Damien to come in and brief us about the extent of
the injuries.

And, , when he came in and said we've managed to remove most of
the shrapnel out of his brain, I went, oh, yeah. So, um,

[00:56:00]

When I talk about it I I still feel like
I'm sitting watching all of that happen. Um. From outside your body. Yeah. Like
I'm sitting at the top of the room like in a corner. Just watching it all
happen and unfold.

And it's just such a surreal experience of oh this is actually
happening. This isn't meant to happen to me. This is meant to happen to
somebody else. I'm not meant to deal with this because I don't know if I can. ,
And I went into shock and I was sitting next to my sister and my mum kept
going, Sonia, and no, sorry, someone kept saying, sorry, and then mum said, no,
she's in shock.

And I just, I blinked and nodded and that was all I could get
out. Um, and so we sat there for a while and the, , the police chaplain, Father
Columba, who is now Archbishop Columba, , came in. With the human services
officer and I'm like, what are yous doing here? I don't

[00:57:00]

need you to be part of this. Like, this is my, this is
my family.

Please go away. And Father Columba was like, well, you might
just need us a little bit. And I'm like, no, please don't start praying for me.
Like, I don't, I don't do that kind of stuff. I don't, I don't want it. We
don't need it. It's going to be fine. And he's like, okay, well, I might just
hang around anyway. I'm like, I just, I just want my family here and I just
wanted us to deal with it as a family.

I don't want the police to be involved. Well, too late. So
yeah, from then on it was, , everyone was involved, I guess is for want of a
better word. Like the whole community was involved, , the media was involved,
all of QPS was involved, and, , police services nationally and even
internationally.

So it wasn't, it was way bigger than me. I was just, just a
piece of it, I suppose. Um, but, and then having to deal with that was

[00:58:00]

extraordinary in itself because we were in
the hospital for what felt like a week. It was not even three days.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

Um,
and the sitting and the waiting and the, you know, it would go from day to
night and you'd just, it would be the blink of an eye.

And then you look out on the street and like, well.

Life's just going on for everybody else. I'm in here living in
this bubble of, I don't know, you know, I knew what was going to happen, but
how I just find it so hard still to go one minute they're there and then
they're not, and then your life is like, it's completely different.

It's just, yeah, it's. It's just unfathomable that, um, I don't
know, I just, the destruction that, , that one person caused in our life, and
not only our life, like a number of other lives as well, I just can't even get
my head around it. And it's still

[00:59:00]

one of those things where I'm like, Oh, I need to tell Damien something.

Oh, that's right. And you know, we're nearly 14 years into
this. And there's still things. One of the kids will do something, and I'll be
like, Oh. Maybe I'll just go tell mum and dad, because we dual live, so, you
know, they're just there all the time, but, yeah, there are things that I'm
thinking, I wonder if you can see this, like, I wonder if you can see.

Where we're at and what the kids are doing and I don't know, is
there a life after? I don't

Rosie Skene:

know.
That's something like I was going to ask you about later, but you know, we
talked to before about your intuition as well. Like, so with the police officer
that came to school and then that gut feeling that you got the day before
Damien got shot.

And then, um, Afterwards as well, you know, are you spiritual
like that?

Sonya Leeding:

I
don't know. Yeah. What do I say to the kids? Oh, look, I believe in something.
I have to get out of bed every day for something, right? Yeah. And I said,
well, with the kids, because they both

[01:00:00]

go to schools that, um, practice religious practices.

I'm not anti that. I'm like, if you want to believe, and
Hudson's very much a, I'm a Christian Mum and, , That's what I believe. And I
said, great, you need something to believe in. Um, and for a really long time,
I was like, I don't believe in anything. Like, what in this world would do this
to someone and then just expect it to be okay?

You know, and you always hear, oh, it wouldn't have happened to
you if you couldn't handle it. I'm like, what? You know, and just different
things, throwaway comments that people make.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

Um,
it's just, I believe there's something, but I just don't know. I don't know.
Even at my age now, I'm like, I still don't know.

I'm searching for that one thing.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,
I'm, I'm sort of very similar to you. Um, I don't, I'm not religious. Probably
a little bit more spiritual now than I used to be like this. There's something
and I've seen a, um,

[01:01:00]

a clairvoyant a
couple of times as well, um, which is just, I find the most amazing experience
because she's very good.

Yeah. Um, yeah, but yeah. I noticed that throughout your book,
like there's little times in your life when you've had these little feelings.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah,
yeah, it's um, yeah, but the day Damien was killed, I was just like, this is,
that makes sense now, that's why I felt like that. That's why there was that
pull to go back home, but I wasn't going to because I wanted him to have a good
rest to go to work and not be disturbed by the kids and what have you.

Um, and then I guess the, the. the blessing is that we did have
those couple of days with him in the hospital, um, and we were able to say
goodbye. And I think, although it was long and it was very odd, like, it's
just, I can't even explain it. Like, maybe that's why people don't talk about
childbirth, because you can't really explain it.

[01:02:00]

Um, just sitting
there, Waiting for someone to die and knowing that that's going to be the
outcome and you can't change it. It's out of your control. Um, it just, yeah,
it blew my mind and I was like, no, I'm going to be alright. I'm going to be
fine. And then I'd be like, no, I'm not. Um, I don't know how I'm going to cope
without him.

And how am I going to raise 2 kids? And, um, I suppose all that
sort of reasoning was tested a little bit when we spoke to the medical team
about turning off the machines. You know, and I guess my 1st question for them
was, so what's the likelihood of him ever coming out of this? And they're like,
well, there's no brain activity.

We've done what we can to assist, but it's not working. Um, and
I said, so what happens then? Like, if I say no, like you leave him on the
ventilators, they go, he'll be on the ventilators forever

[01:03:00]

until he, and ordinarily, I think this is
possibly how it happens with people in that situation is that they get a virus
or they get sick and eventually everything else shuts down and that's it.

And I'm like, But I've got two babies, like how can I live at
the hospital for the rest of my life with these two kids who need to have a
life as well? And I went, it's a no brainer, why would I keep him in that state
and wait and prolong the inevitable? You know, why would you do that? So I
guess that's why that the decision of turning the machines off was, um, yeah,
such a no brainer.

A no brainer, for want of a better word, like, he would have
hated being stuck in that bed for any longer than he had to be, um, and he
probably would have been embarrassed about the amount of people who came to see
him as well, but I was like, , once, obviously, once we'd realized that there
was no return,

[01:04:00]

um, I had said to a
few of his colleagues and texts and said, whoever needs to come to the
hospital, come to the hospital, because they were, you know, they were under
police guard and couldn't come in unless you're a direct family.

And in the end, I said, stuff them, just come up. And the nurse
unit manager kept saying, can you stop sending everyone up here? We've got a
job to do. There's other people in here. I said, I know, but we are in this
particular part and I've been in that room before with other families. And. Um,
yeah, just people that just wanted to come and sit.

Um, I just went, just be there, just let him know that you're
there and, and do what you need to do as well. Because it wasn't just me losing
him, even though I'd wanted it to be, to tell everyone to bugger off. You know,
you're going through the, I don't want anyone to miss out. But he's my husband
and

my life and my kid's life.

And yeah, so it was that real struggle of, I want everyone to
come in, but I also want to keep him for myself.

Rosie Skene:

I think
that's so generous of you

[01:05:00]

to be able
to do that. Knowing, you know, he was going to pass away soon, that you allowed
that to happen. When I would have felt the same as you, like, I just want him
all to myself for these last moments that I can get.

Wow, that's incredible.

Sonya Leeding:

I
think maybe that was that bit of hope of if there's someone that can make a
difference. Yeah, if there's just someone that can just wake that spark up in
his brain, and I know he's never going to be the same, but at least he'd be
here. But yeah, um, no, that was, yeah, it was just inevitable that he was
going to pass.

So, um, I think once we, well, once I said yes, that we were
going to turn the machines off, then yeah, everyone started preparing for that.
So, um. Yeah, it's, yeah, just a whole other experience.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah, I
can't even imagine it. Um, and like you said, you're only there for a couple of
days in the hospital, but that would have felt like an absolute eternity.

Sonya Leeding:

It
really did. Yeah. It was

[01:06:00]

so strange.
And then coming out, like leaving, I was like, Oh, now what do I do? Like,
what? So we went home. And, um, Like, I was paranoid about the media.

Rosie Skene:

Um, they
would have been swarming the hospital, right?

Sonya Leeding:

Yep.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.
Yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

So
they were everywhere. And it was funny because, um, my sister walked in with
her son and Christy at the time was Yeah, so she was like three months off
giving birth to her second child and she had her infant son with her as well.

And so she'd walk in with this and then they'd put her face all
over the paper saying, Oh, and Sonia arrived at the hospital with Grace and I'm
going. Oh, that's not me. Dickheads. Like, come on. As if I'm going to walk up
the main entrance.

Yeah. Like, every time I left, I'd either leave with a whole
bunch of detectives and just be in a group and jump into a car.

And I did, look, I left twice. I came

[01:07:00]

home twice. And I also popped into Southport Station because I just needed to
just go and be with my people. That makes sense. Um, just be with the blue
family. And I didn't even care who was working. I just wanted to be out of the
hospital just to, yeah, try,

I don't know, I don't know, escape, I guess.

So yeah, we were very cautious as to who I spoke to. I was very
cautious as to who I spoke to. And, you know, obviously with these sorts of
things, the media are very interested. And, uh, To the point where one day
they'd gone to my house and leaned over the fence and taken a photo of some
washing and I was like, right, that was it.

I went, I'm not speaking to anyone ever again. Yeah, like, no,
there's no interviews, you're not getting anything out of me. So that, and that
relationship lasted for 10 years. Yeah, yeah. So, yeah. I know when the 10 year
anniversary came up and I spoke to quite a few. Yeah. That um, the bulletin and
what have you.

They're like, I can't

[01:08:00]

believe you haven't spoken to anyone. I said, no because one of you bastards
hung over my fence and took photos of my washing and did this time. It was a
tiny little article right at the bottom of the page literally to say, oh, life
is back to normal. There's washing on the line in the Leeding household, you
know, and I went, no, it's not.

I'm at the hospital waiting for my husband to die. You know,
it's just, yeah, I just went, oh my god, can you just take a step away and go,
this is somebody's life. your, yes it's just a photo of washing and really it
doesn't mean anything, but it did to me, out of all the articles, there's pages
and pages of, you know, what's happening with Damien and the job and what have
you, and this tiny little piece at the bottom of the paper I went, and that's
it, yeah, pull it

Rosie Skene:

less,
yeah,

Sonya Leeding:

yeah,

Rosie Skene:

so
Invasive.

Sonya Leeding:

Very.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah.
I felt violated. I was just like, Oh my God, can you just take a step back?
Yes. Go and talk to the neighbours if you have to, which they did anyway, um,

[01:09:00]

to get comment, which was rather
interesting because we didn't really talk to anyone. So yeah. I'm like, not
really knew us, but good luck. Um, yeah, so.

It was so weird coming out and I'm going, fuck the media. I'm
not having anything to do with them. So even getting out of the hospital, we
went out a side door and across the road and the media stayed down at the main
entrance. So we managed to avoid them there as well. But yeah, getting home was
It was so strange and I was just like, I don't know what to do.

What do you do? Yeah, what am I supposed to do? There were
these two kids, I didn't have to worry about them because there were a hundred
people in my house who were looking after them all the time. Um, but I remember
Getting home and I didn't, I didn't go anywhere in the house. I just went
straight to bed, pulled the sheets and doona up and went, that's it, I'm out.

And I just, I cried myself to sleep and stayed there for a few
hours. But, , yeah, my sister Mel's like, cause everyone had been

[01:10:00]

staying at home. , she's like, and then
all these police turned up, like they all just turned up. Like all of Damien's
colleagues and they were all like in the house and, and, and it was just packed
and they were just packed.

People everywhere. And her husband at the time turned around to
them I think it was actually Mel that said to them What are you doing here?
Because they didn't know what to do either. They didn't know where to be. They
didn't know what to do with themselves. And a lot of them were his colleagues.
And I was like, SoSonya'sn bed.

Can you all just go? Yeah. So by the time I woke up there was
hardly anyone at home. The house was silent. I woke up and I'm like Did this
just happen? It's such, it's the strangest thing. You know, that, of, oh, he's
not coming home. I'm never going to see him again. We're never going to have a
conversation.

The kids don't have a father to grow up with. What, what do we
do? So I walked out to the kitchen and I saw that everyone had been drinking
champagne and I went,

[01:11:00]

Um, where's
mine? And they're like, you were asleep. I'm like, what? I think I need a
drink. I don't know how I'm going to get through this. And that was the start
of a very bumpy journey.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.
Wow. That's so intense, isn't it? And, you know, just with that, um, what do we
do now? Like, and you're never going to have that conversation again. Do you
still think that? Like, do you still? Yeah. Yeah. I still think, well,

Sonya Leeding:

I
don't know. Okay. You know, even if further down the track say something had
happened and we didn't end up together, he'd still be there.

He'd still be the kid's dad. And he was like, he still is. But

Speaker:

yeah,

Sonya Leeding:

he's,
they can't talk to him.

Rosie Skene:

I just
want to talk a little bit about being in the public eye while you're going
through that because I can't imagine anything worse.

Then losing your husband in such a tragic situation, having
two, like a baby and a small child,

[01:12:00]

but then just being. thrust out into the world while you're going through all
of that when all I can imagine you would have wanted is to just go home and
shut the door and just deal with it within your family.

Yeah. How did you, I don't even know if you could have managed
it at the time because it was so much, but how did you get through that and
pass that?

Sonya Leeding:

I
think, um, so when that was happening, it was very much, , I wanted to shut
everyone out. And I didn't want people to know, but because our faces have been
splashed everywhere.

And originally when, um, I was approached about having the
funeral televised, I'd said, they said, QPS is gone. And I went, we said no.
And I went, wait a minute, what if there's people that can't make it? Yeah. So
I guess I invited the media in then. And I thought, well, okay.

[01:13:00]

And, you know, we didn't get stalked or
anything like that when we went out, but there were definitely people that
would go, Aren't you?

Oh, you're that. And then they'd look at Hudson and see his
curls and go, Oh, that's that little boy, you know, from the funeral. Cause he
was playing with his cars right next to Damien's coffin. But then I guess with
Grace, because she was a baby, she could be anyone now, you know what I mean?
Like, she's not very recognizable, I guess, in terms of that.

But yeah, I'd be like. I remember going out and thinking, Oh, I
need to get the kids a special piece of jewellery to wear for the funeral. And
so this is a few days after. And so I went to like the local Westfield and I'm
walking through and I'm thinking, Everyone else is just getting on with their
life and do they not realize that the worst thing that could possibly happen
has happened to me and I wanted them to know that but I was also like, I don't
want them to look at me.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, there's that. I don't want

[01:14:00]

you to forget what's happened and I want
everyone to know that I'm hurting and this is why, you know, I'm I'm gonna be
the way I am. But then I'd go to buy the jewelry and I'm like, oh yeah, it's
for my husband's funeral for the kids and So shop assistants would look at me
and go, okay, I'm like, yeah, he was that police officer that got shot just
because I couldn't stop myself.

I was like, I want them to know why I'm buying this jewelry
because I don't want anyone to forget. And then I'd be like, but it was too
late. It was already out of my mouth. I couldn't even stop it. So I had this
real. I want to do it all in private, but I don't want anyone to forget the
community to forget the sacrifice that Damien made.

And that probably brings me to the next point is that he was
labeled a hero, and so he should be. Um, but then, I was his wife and I'm like,
well, what does a hero's wife behave like? How am I supposed to, what am I
supposed

[01:15:00]

to do? What kind of, um,
persona am I supposed to put out there? Am I supposed to be quiet and just go
along with everything?

And I'm thinking, yeah, okay, that's not going to happen. Um,
so it was a really fine line of, yeah, making sure I didn't want the community
to forget what had happened,

which was probably also me going, I don't want to forget about
him either. I don't want it to be. last week's news. Um, but I also didn't want
the intrusion of how am I supposed to be behaving, you know, forgetting that
I've got to go home and try and mother two children and do that sort of thing
as well.

But it was just, yeah, a really fine line to try and balance
what I thought I had to be.

Speaker:

Yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

And
what the community expected. And not that they didn't expect it. necessarily
expected anything. That was probably an expectation that I put on myself. So
then I was like, Oh, okay, well, I'm Damien's wife. And for a long time, that's
what I was reduced to.

I was Damien's wife, the widow.

[01:16:00]

And that was it.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

But
again, with that, that is quite a problematic, um, definition of myself, I
suppose, in that I was reduced to a person who was defined by somebody else.
Yeah. I've never by anyone else. . Yeah. So like, well, okay. Yep. I'm Damien's
wife and I just did what I had to do to get through

Rosie Skene:

Yeah, I,
I have a question about that actually, because. That's, um, you identify
yourself as so many things, like in your book, like you can see like you're a
police officer and you're like this fierce, it comes across that you are a
fierce woman, very strong, very sure of yourself. , and then to have that sort
of label, I guess, for that period of time as Damien's wife or Damien's widow.

, and, um, yeah. It's such a significant part of your life. How
do you, how did you come over time to be Sonya Leeding you know, and all the
things that you are like a

[01:17:00]

mother,
police officer, detective in one of the most serious branches, if not the most
serious branch that you could work in. Are you still in child protection now?

Speaker:

Yeah, still

Rosie Skene:

there.
Yeah. So, I mean, you're so many other things. How did you find yourself again?
to be Sonya after going through that?

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah,
look, um, I think it was around, because for such a long time, and I think
after a while it ended up being a crutch as well, it was like, um, Damien's
wife, it was like my leave pass to carry on like an idiot, and if we're out,
I'd be, I'd be the most drunk out of everyone, and what have you, like, it was
just, It was a competition.

Oh, look, there's the widow. She's drunk again. You know, like,
yeah. Yeah. And I was like, it's my leave pass. Great. Get out of jail free
car. Um, I suppose it probably all came about. Um, and I just speak about this
in my book briefly. I was

[01:18:00]

remarried,
um, in 2018 and it was a very quick relationship. Um, I felt like at the time
that if I was defined by someone else, if I was someone else's wife, that it
would show that I've moved on.

Um, I thought that I had all my shit together. I did not. I was
drinking three bottles of wine a day, like in, you know, I'd go to work and
what have you and do all the things I needed to do, but I'd get home and I'd
down three bottles before I went to bed. Um, so it was, that was probably.

About the time where I went, this isn't good. And unfortunately
for him, he was the collateral damage in that. And, um, I don't know that
anything could have stopped that because it could have been any different.
Yeah, I shouldn't say it could have been anyone. It wouldn't have been anyone.
Um, but you know, it was, it was that time in my life where I went, I've got to
prove myself that I'm

[01:19:00]

okay, that
I've moved on, that, um, I'm trying to build a life with my kids and you know,
I've got

a new dad and all this sort of stuff and, and it, it didn't sit
right.

In theory, it looked pretty on the outside, but at home, I was
an anxious bundle of nerves. Thanks. I was depressed, um, I'd often come home
and be in an absolute foul mood and wouldn't want to speak to him or my
parents. And the kids were copping it, and, you know, I was just losing my shit
at little things.

And, which, um, I might add, losing my shit at little things
was a, a big way of me dealing with Damien's loss. Um, so everything would just
be a big thing and I think anyone that dealt with me during that period would
never quite know what response they would get if it was something that would
um, inflame me or just, yeah, just the anger.

I was just so angry for such a long time and my reactions were
overreactions a lot of the

[01:20:00]

time as
well. So I think that, um, yeah, that relationship was probably me going, Oh, I
need, I need to do something. To be me, but that wasn't the right way to do it.
So after we split, I, um, I'd started going to F45 probably around August 2018.

And it was a, I'd only go to the nine o'clock sessions because
I could be asked getting out of bed early because I'd probably had too much to
drink the night before. And nine AM I could get my head around and drop the
kids off and then I go to the gym. And so that would depend on what shifts I
was working.

So sometimes I'd only get there once a week and really it was
not worth it. Um, and so after that I went, Right, um, I'm going to do the
next, you know, eight week challenge or whatever it was. So I signed up for
that and That was probably a lot of getting my head right as well. So it was no
alcohol, no coffee.

[01:21:00]

God forbid the headaches for two days were ridiculous. Um, yes,
I drink coffee now. Um, but yeah, for the most part, I didn't drink at all. And
if I did, it would be one or two glasses at a function or something like that.
And I'd always make sure I drove so that I didn't drink. Um. I just went, this
is a much better version of me.

And I was able to give my kids what they needed as a mum as
well. Like, I felt like I was back with them. I wasn't always angry. And, um, I
think at the time I really looked at it and went, I feel like I'm slipping into
that. Um, what I felt like with postnatal is that I was resenting having
children, that they were disrupting my life, that I couldn't do anything.

And, you know, I was also still, um, No, I got back to work
full time by then as well. I'd been back full time for a year, so I had, uh,
quite a long time working part time hours just because I went, oh, I just can't
cope with it and, and then I went, oh, both the kids are at school now and I
keep going out for lunch every day and

[01:22:00]

drinking wine and this is not great.

Nice lifestyle, but it's not maintainable. Um, so yeah, after
that relationship ended, I just really threw myself into trying to find me
again and what I really liked to do and. Yeah, um, F45 won that battle. So that
was, it's been, yeah, I've been there since then. I still go regularly. , And
that really was my time.

It's only 45 minutes. It's my time. I get in there. Someone
tells me what to do, how long for, and then it goes beep and then you move. And
I'm like, oh, good, someone's telling me what to do finally. I don't always
listen, but you know, whatever. Um, that's how it is. And that training really
worked for me. So that was, that was just a, an absolute game changer.

And then eventually I went,

Oh, I might start seeing if I can do the early mornings. So,
yeah, I've been doing the early mornings for a few years now and that's changed
my life because I

[01:23:00]

can fit more
classes in a week. And now the kids are seeing that and they're like, mum gets
up and does this and then comes home and does, you know, kid stuff and goes to
work and then does it.

Yeah, I managed to get that balance back. But that time in the
morning for me has just given me a whole new lease of life. Yes, I still drink
wine. I try not to drink it as much. I definitely don't drink three bottles a
day. Um, but, you know, I think alcohol is probably going to be the biggest
struggle. Um, but then I also know if I'm starting to crash emotionally.

I'll be like, Oh, okay, you got to watch that drinking because
that's, you know, that's a depressant. That's not going to help you. Um, I was
medicated for a while, but I just, because I couldn't sleep, um, it just took
the edge off to actually relax my brain and, and stop thinking about why did
this happen to me?

Um, how am I going to survive? What am I like? What am I
supposed to do? Who am I? And, um, I guess around

[01:24:00]

that time as well, I got my job in plain clothes in the CPIU. And um, that was
the start of it. Like, it was the start of finding my identity, considering I
went from being a 15 year old who was enamored by this juvenile aid bureau
detective.

She was a detective. I was like, yes. And I know when I went
through the academy, they're like, Oh, so where do you think you'll end up in
your career? Where are you going to go? So, and I'm like, I'm going to be a
detective at Surfers Paradise CIB. And I'm like, yeah. And I did some station
duty there. I went, no, I don't want to work there.

Um, we went through it our first year. I don't want to work
there. It's a boys club. Nah, I don't want to work there. Um, but it always
came back to the child protection unit with kids. And, um, you know, the most
rewarding part is, is helping those victims. The kids that don't have a voice
or the kids that are these muck up kids, but they've had so much trauma.

If you start to unpack that, they're like, oh.

[01:25:00]

You know, I had one recently who, child in
care, and she's an adult now, but we had a win in court with her offender and,
and I didn't think she was going to participate in that, um, in the court
process at all. And here she is, she's a Mum of two kids now, and she fully
participated as a, um, a victim survivor.

And we ended up with a great result. And I just went, when I
first spoke to her, I thought, oh, This is going to be really hard. Um, and it
was all via phone cause she's not on the Gold Coast. And yeah, she was just
brilliant. Cause I'd, you know, I'd read her file and I'd read all the
difficulties she'd had.

And I'm thinking these kids come from a trauma base and all
this stuff's happened to her because of that, because she can't find where she
fits.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.

Sonya Leeding:

And
then we're, yeah, we were able to do something to help her. I'm like, Oh, it
might take a lot of, um, investigations to actually get some decent ones, but
when you do, and you can see that these kids are

[01:26:00]

benefiting from it, yeah, it's just amazing.

So rewarding, yeah. Yeah, so I guess, yeah, becoming a
plainclothes officer and then eventually over three years, and I did my
appointment in just under three, but you have to wait three years to get your
appointment, um, that for me was just I did this on my own. This, this was for
me. You know, it's, it does sound wanky, but guess what guys?

You know how I said I was going to be a detective? Well, I am.
Yeah. Hi. I did it. Um,

Rosie Skene:

you may
now refer to me as detective.

Oh, that's so good.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah.
So I think, yeah, those were the things where I went, I'm doing this for me.
I'm doing my gym for me, um, putting back into rebuilding myself from the core,
and it was pretty broken. Um, has just been, yeah, just what I needed and I
don't know, like grief is just such a shitty thing to go through.

There's no, there's no manual bit like

[01:27:00]

child, um, raising children.

Rosie Skene:

Mm-hmm .

Sonya Leeding:

But
um, yeah, I just sort of think if you can. And, you know, in your emails, yeah,
if you can get up each day and have a shower or make your bed or whatever it
was and, you know, just one small thing or have one small thing to get up for,
there's going to be one little bit of joy.

It just makes it a whole lot easier. Like, you know, it's not
going to go away. It never goes away. Um, and, and it's like waves as well. You
just. Yeah. Sometimes they're massive and other times they're just little
ripples. So it's, um, yeah, it's a really, it's a long journey, um, and I don't
think it's ever over.

But I think if you can, you know, break it down into small,
smaller chunks and just try and, you know, do one day at a time or one minute
at a time, like if it's, you know, if that's what you need, do it.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah,
that's so amazing that you said that

[01:28:00]

because it is, isn't it? Just some things just seem so overwhelming.

I can't. Imagine, you know, how you've, when you said, , you
had to come home and then what do I do now? Like,

Sonya Leeding:

I'm
stuck here with these two kids by myself. That was not the plan. Yeah. But just
one, one thing. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, a couple of my girlfriends said to
me, we knew you weren't well when you, Didn't brush your hair or you didn't
brush your teeth, or you just get up and check Damo's trackies on and be like,
right, we're going out.

And we'd look at you because they're often come to me for, Hey,
son, can we borrow stuff outta your wardrobe ? And they went, I'm wearing a
pair of trackies and a flannel.

No, , no.

Um, no.

Rosie Skene:

Let's
help you out.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah.
Yeah. So they were like, oh, she's not doing well this week. . But yeah, I
mean, they were good. They just, they were there.

Rosie Skene:

I think
that's a testament, isn't it? To having a good support network. Your parents,
obviously, throughout your book were just

[01:29:00]

amazing for you and the kids and then your friends as well, , to pick you up.
That's so important in life.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah,
and you know, um, going through grief, I think you soon work out who's going to
stay in your circle.

Um, and there are people that I would used to see and and we
were good friends with a couple of them and I'm just like, I'd be like, I don't
know what to say. And so they just, they just sort of drifted off and not to be
heard from again. And I'm like, Oh, well, I, you know, I'm not going to chase
that because that's just going to hurt me and leave it there.

Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

Just
wanted to ask for a piece of advice, actually. So you've shown immense strength
in the most unimaginable loss. What Advice would you have for others? It could
be like first responders of people grieving in the public eye who are
navigating their own journeys of grief and healing.

Sonya Leeding:

Uh,
look, um,

[01:30:00]

I think like I said
before, you just just try and do what you can do. Don't think that grief is
this. Package. That's just, you know, you're going to get through it in a day
because it's not going to happen.

Um, you know, and all the stages of grief, there's, yeah, like
I said, I was angry for a really long time. And I

think just embrace each of those stages. Don't try and rush
anything either. Make sure you're actually feeling all of those emotions
because I think the residual stuff that's left behind is what can really fester
away and hurt you and you know, I'm a, I'm a big believer that the more that
sort of sticks around that people get sick from that.

Um, and I'm not just saying mental health wise either. I think
physically your body takes a toll and things happen. Um, I think the best
advice is, you know, just find that one little thing each day that you can.
Either it helps you get out of bed in the

[01:31:00]

morning, whether that be my first cup of coffee or, um, you know, going in and
snuggling the kids to wake them up or, so these are things for me, and
everyone's going to be different, of course, or if you've got pets, take the
dogs for a walk or whatever it is.

Just that one little thing to give you that piece of light when
it's really dark, I think is just a way to break it down. Um, I don't think
it's something that you should rush I think it's something that you need to sit
with and learn to sit with it. And I think for a long time I didn't. I was
angry. I felt that.

Lots of people felt my anger. Um, but when I went, why am I
reacting like this to something that's probably not that bad? And it was
because I was angry. And that was where I was at in my grieving. , Yeah, I
don't think the stages are necessarily secular. Uh. And they definitely don't
exist by themselves.

Um, so just, yeah, just find that

[01:32:00]

one piece of light that you can in your darkness times. Then, um, yeah, it
might make it a little bit easy, but otherwise it's, , it's definitely a
journey and I don't, yeah, I don't envy anyone having to go through it. Um, I
know in the beginning I had people say to Oh, you need to speak to this person
because they've gone through it.

similar to you. And I'm like, I don't want to talk to them. It
wasn't their husband that was shot. My, it was my husband that was shot. And
you know, there's a similar circumstances, but not the same. And I'd be like, I
don't want to talk to them. So since then, when I've been asked to speak to
people in similar situations, I say, no, I said, the last thing I wanted was
someone else telling me how I'm supposed to do this.

Even though I had no clue. Yeah. I think you have to find it
yourself.

Rosie Skene:

Yeah.
Yeah. Thank you so much, Sonya it, um, I feel really blessed to have met you
and be able to talk to you today and to share , your

[01:33:00]

journey. .

Speaker:

Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

And
Damien's journey and that of your family, I think you are incredible woman.

Um, I really loved your book. I'm going to link to it in the
show notes. Thank you so much for sending it to me. That was such a gift. Like
it's so beautiful.

Sonya Leeding:

Yeah.

Rosie Skene:

It's
amazing. I'll definitely be sharing it around. But thank you so much.

Sonya Leeding:

You're
more than welcome. I hope to speak to you

Rosie Skene:

soon. .

I hope you've enjoyed today's episode. If you have, make sure
to hit subscribe so you never miss any new ones. We release fresh content every
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Your support means the world. My name is Rosie Skene join me
again next week for another empowering and positive episode of Triumph Beyond
Trauma. Until then, be kind to your mind and trust in the magic of your
consistent and positive efforts.

[01:34:00]

Triumph Beyond your trauma is closer than you think. Have the best week.